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<!--quoteo(post=4247:date=Dec 12 2008, 02:00 PM:name=Butcher)-->QUOTE (Butcher @ Dec 12 2008, 02:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Please tell me you didn't just say Abreu is worse than Dunn with the glove.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Abreu is worse than Dunn with the glove.
According to last year's Fielding Bible stats, he was worse than <i>Manny</i>.
There's nothing better than to realize that the good things about youth don't end with youth itself. It's a matter of realizing that life can be renewed every day you get out of bed without baggage. It's tough to get there, but it's better than the dark thoughts. -Lance
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BTW, nobody is saying that Dunn is nimble in the field...only that Abreu, always a poor fielder, has because of age or whatever, become <i>terrible</i> out there.
There's nothing better than to realize that the good things about youth don't end with youth itself. It's a matter of realizing that life can be renewed every day you get out of bed without baggage. It's tough to get there, but it's better than the dark thoughts. -Lance
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Doesn't Abreu have a cannon?
I hate my pretentious sounding username too.
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<!--quoteo(post=4250:date=Dec 12 2008, 02:07 PM:name=KBwsb)-->QUOTE (KBwsb @ Dec 12 2008, 02:07 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->BTW, nobody is saying that Dunn is nimble in the field...only that Abreu, always a poor fielder, has because of age or whatever, become <i>terrible</i> out there.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'll admit that I didn't see much of Abreu as a Yankee, but I thought he was a plus defender with the Phillies. He could cover a lot of ground out there and had an incredible arm (as CD mentioned). Dunn has jack shit as far as defensive tools. He's slow, clumsy, he gets a terrible read on the ball, his misplays a ton, and his arm is weak.
If Abreu is worse in the field, then he's taken a dramatic turn for the worse in the last couple of seasons.
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<!--quoteo(post=4251:date=Dec 12 2008, 02:13 PM:name=CD2W)-->QUOTE (CD2W @ Dec 12 2008, 02:13 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Doesn't Abreu have a cannon?<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yep, he got it from an 18th century pirate ship and it has since be restored to its original luster. I've seen pictures, it's a very nice...
I picture a pissed-off Amazon bitch; uncontrollable, disobedient, boldly resisting any kind of emotional shackles...angrily begging for more ejaculate. -KB
Showing your teeth is a sign of weakness in primates. Whenever someone smiles at me, all I see is a chimpanzee begging for its life. - Dwight
RIP Sarge
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<!--quoteo(post=4225:date=Dec 12 2008, 12:47 PM:name=Tailgater)-->QUOTE (Tailgater @ Dec 12 2008, 12:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Is it just me, or does Bradley scare the hell out of anyone else. I just don't know if this team needs another situation like Sosa, Lofton, or Barrett.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
There was a situation with Lofton?
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<!--quoteo(post=4267:date=Dec 12 2008, 02:50 PM:name=Brock)-->QUOTE (Brock @ Dec 12 2008, 02:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=4225:date=Dec 12 2008, 12:47 PM:name=Tailgater)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tailgater @ Dec 12 2008, 12:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Is it just me, or does Bradley scare the hell out of anyone else. I just don't know if this team needs another situation like Sosa, Lofton, or Barrett.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
There was a situation with Lofton?
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't know if there was a specific situation, but I've read that he's a problem in the clubhouse. Don't know if it's true or not...
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I know there are typically some bad decisions regarding Gold Glove winners, but Abreu won one in 2005. I can't imagine he's regressed enough since then to become worse in the field than Adam Dunn.
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Abreu is supposed to have taken drastic steps backwards defensively the last few years. I have heard fans call in on XM ripping him for being scared of the wall.
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<!--quoteo(post=4305:date=Dec 12 2008, 04:56 PM:name=cigar)-->QUOTE (cigar @ Dec 12 2008, 04:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Abreu is supposed to have taken drastic steps backwards defensively the last few years. I have heard fans call in on XM ripping him for being scared of the wall.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Bingo I was just gonna post that. He's totally afraid of the wall. Can you imagine him near the bricks? I get furious every time Soriano lets up near the wall, I don't want another guy like that.
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<!--quoteo(post=4196:date=Dec 12 2008, 09:27 AM:name=Ace)-->QUOTE (Ace @ Dec 12 2008, 09:27 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Clapp's gonna be sad.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Nah, I'm more upset about how the world champs are going to be better. 3 years 30 mil was pushing my limit on what I wanted to give him, and I certainly didn't want to get in a bidding war. I'm fine with Bradley.
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You guys, I'm not making this stuff up. Go to the Fielding Bible site. They rank <!--coloro:#00BFFF--><!--/coloro-->Abreu<!--colorc-->
<!--/colorc--> as the WORST defensive RF in all MLB last year.
Now, admittedly, that's only one defensive ranking system, but it's widely respected, and even if you were highly questionable of their thorough methods of evaluation, wouldn't the news make you at least think..."Hmm, perhaps the fellow has declined a bit since I last saw him 5 years ago?"
Here's <!--coloro:#FF00FF--><!--/coloro-->Keith Law<!--colorc-->
<!--/colorc-->'s take of Abreu:
BJ (Chicago): Hey KLaw, can you explain why you're down on Abreu, he still hits 290ish, with 20 HRs, 100 RBIs, 20 SBs, and an all important OBP in the upper 300's. I'm hearing the White Sox are interested, and it seems like he's still producing enough to matter, no?
Keith Law: Brutal defensive outfielder with declining power. I do like him, but the minuses are starting to creep up on the pluses.
There's nothing better than to realize that the good things about youth don't end with youth itself. It's a matter of realizing that life can be renewed every day you get out of bed without baggage. It's tough to get there, but it's better than the dark thoughts. -Lance
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Problem is you're comparing a RF with LF, and believe me if Dunn played all his games in RF he'd end up ranked lower than Abreu. I don't care how much he's supposedly regressed.
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<!--quoteo(post=4445:date=Dec 13 2008, 01:58 AM:name=rok)-->QUOTE (rok @ Dec 13 2008, 01:58 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Problem is you're comparing a RF with LF, and believe me if Dunn played all his games in RF he'd end up ranked lower than Abreu. I don't care how much he's supposedly regressed.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Rok, that's a fair point, I suppose. So what you're saying is that, yes, Abreu may be the worst defensive RF in baseball, but it's possible/likely that if Dunn were signed by Jim, and switched to RF, his defense would be as bad, or worse.
I agree. Although it'd be close. They're both lousy defenders.
And conversely, they're both outstanding OBP guys.
So, in comparing the two, so far, it's a wash.
Now let's add in this: Adam Dunn is 28. Abreu is 36.
<i>Eight</i> years older.
And then this: Abreu hits about 19 HR a year. His last 3 years: 15, 16, 20.
Dunn hits 40 homers. Every year. Every SINGLE year. For the past 4 seasons, he has hit exactly 40 home runs every single season. That has to be some sort of record for exactitude in consistency.
Five years ago he pounded 46, so yes, you could say he dropped off a bit, but he still is a mortal lock to outhomer Abreu by at least <i>double</i>.
To me, there's no comparison.
There's nothing better than to realize that the good things about youth don't end with youth itself. It's a matter of realizing that life can be renewed every day you get out of bed without baggage. It's tough to get there, but it's better than the dark thoughts. -Lance
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<!--quoteo(post=4448:date=Dec 13 2008, 03:21 AM:name=KBwsb)-->QUOTE (KBwsb @ Dec 13 2008, 03:21 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=4445:date=Dec 13 2008, 01:58 AM:name=rok)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rok @ Dec 13 2008, 01:58 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Problem is you're comparing a RF with LF, and believe me if Dunn played all his games in RF he'd end up ranked lower than Abreu. I don't care how much he's supposedly regressed.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Rok, that's a fair point, I suppose. So what you're saying is that, yes, Abreu may be the worst defensive RF in baseball, but it's possible/likely that if Dunn were signed by Jim, and switched to RF, his defense would be as bad, or worse.
I agree. Although it'd be close. They're both lousy defenders.
And conversely, they're both outstanding OBP guys.
So, in comparing the two, so far, it's a wash.
Now let's add in this: Adam Dunn is 28. Abreu is 36.
<i>Eight</i> years older.
And then this: Abreu hits about 19 HR a year. His last 3 years: 15, 16, 20.
Dunn hits 40 homers. Every year. Every SINGLE year. For the past 4 seasons, he has hit exactly 40 home runs every single season. That has to be some sort of record for exactitude in consistency.
Five years ago he pounded 46, so yes, you could say he dropped off a bit, but he still is a mortal lock to outhomer Abreu by at least <i>double</i>.
To me, there's no comparison.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Dunn's the worst outfielder in the league, no doubt about it. But as you pointed out about Abreu and I keep saying, he put up those small home run numbers at Yankee Stadium, with a right field porch 314 feet away. How many is he going to hit out at Wrigley where it's 40 feet further down the line? He's still a good overall hitter that gets on base and will drive in 100 runs, but he's declining offensively and defensively. He's still got a pretty good arm, but I don't want a guy that's afraid of the wall playing where we have a brick wall. He'd probably let up 10 feet before the warning track.
Of the FA choices now, I'm definitely for Bradley. I assume we're not going to win anyway, so why not take the gamble? If we hadn't kept DeRo to backup Bradley and his 90 games, then I wouldn't feel as good about it. I love Bradley's fire though and I agree he'd likely thrive in the playoffs. If we can have him healthy for then, I don't really care how many regular season games he plays, just like Rich Harden.
We're winning this shitty division, I'm not in the least bit worried about that. CC leaving the division was the best thing that could've happened to our offseason. Winning in October should be our only focus. Let's bring in St. Bradley.
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