Kevin Gregg

[ruby23]

<!--quoteo(post=45863:date=Jun 23 2009, 10:21 PM:name=Runnys)-->QUOTE (Runnys @ Jun 23 2009, 10:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=45858:date=Jun 23 2009, 09:32 PM:name=ruby23)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ruby23 @ Jun 23 2009, 09:32 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=45856:date=Jun 23 2009, 09:23 PM:name=Lance)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Lance @ Jun 23 2009, 09:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Playoffs? With Gregg as a closer? Pshaw.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Ok for fuck's sake, if the Cubs don't make the playoffs, it won't be because of Kevin Gregg. Gimme a fucking break.

There's about 2 lockdown closers out there and about 20 mediocre ones (the category Gregg falls into), there's gonna be about 6-7 teams in the playoffs with mediocre closers.
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I agree with the fact that if the Cubs miss the playoffs it will not be because of Gregg. However Ruby, your statement about the closers and playoff teams is ridiculous. As it stands right now the closers for the playoff teams would be:

Jonathan Papelbon
Mariano Rivera
Fernando Rodney
Frank Francisco/CJ Wilson
Brad Lidge
Ryan Franklin
Jonathan Broxton

The current WC teams in the NL would have Hoffman or Brian Wilson

I would take ANY ONE of those closers over Kevin Gregg. When healthy, Papelbon, Rivera, Francisco, and Broxton are as lock down as it gets. Lidge has had a tough time, but we cannot forget he did not blow a save at all last year. IMO, Gregg is worse that any one of those closers except maybe Rodney and Franklin.
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I'd suggest you look up some statistics.

[Runnys]

<!--quoteo(post=45868:date=Jun 23 2009, 10:40 PM:name=ruby23)-->QUOTE (ruby23 @ Jun 23 2009, 10:40 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=45863:date=Jun 23 2009, 10:21 PM:name=Runnys)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Runnys @ Jun 23 2009, 10:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=45858:date=Jun 23 2009, 09:32 PM:name=ruby23)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ruby23 @ Jun 23 2009, 09:32 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=45856:date=Jun 23 2009, 09:23 PM:name=Lance)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Lance @ Jun 23 2009, 09:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Playoffs? With Gregg as a closer? Pshaw.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Ok for fuck's sake, if the Cubs don't make the playoffs, it won't be because of Kevin Gregg. Gimme a fucking break.

There's about 2 lockdown closers out there and about 20 mediocre ones (the category Gregg falls into), there's gonna be about 6-7 teams in the playoffs with mediocre closers.
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I agree with the fact that if the Cubs miss the playoffs it will not be because of Gregg. However Ruby, your statement about the closers and playoff teams is ridiculous. As it stands right now the closers for the playoff teams would be:

Jonathan Papelbon
Mariano Rivera
Fernando Rodney
Frank Francisco/CJ Wilson
Brad Lidge
Ryan Franklin
Jonathan Broxton

The current WC teams in the NL would have Hoffman or Brian Wilson

I would take ANY ONE of those closers over Kevin Gregg. When healthy, Papelbon, Rivera, Francisco, and Broxton are as lock down as it gets. Lidge has had a tough time, but we cannot forget he did not blow a save at all last year. IMO, Gregg is worse that any one of those closers except maybe Rodney and Franklin.
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I'd suggest you look up some statistics.
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Ryan Franklin 17 saves, 1.00 ERA, 0.89 WHIP
Broxton 17 saves, 2.29 ERA, 0.82 WHIP
Hoffman 16 saves, 1.31 ERA, 0.77 WHIP
Papelbon 16 saves, 1.80 ERA, 1.40 WHIP
Rivera 15 saves, 3.25 ERA, 1.08 WHIP
Francisco 12 saves, 0.44 ERA, 0.77 WHIP
Brian Wilson 19 saves, 2.94 ERA, 1.16 WHIP

Are those the stats you were suggesting? If any of those guys are listed as mediocre closers...then Gregg is absolute fucking dogshit! Lidge has had a terrible year and I said that Gregg and Rodney are about the same. The seven I just listed though are far superior to Gregg. Also, of the 22 closers with 10 or more saves, Gregg ERA is only lower than 6 of them. His WHIP is only lower than 5 of them. What else would you like me to look up? I think that WHIP is the most telling stat for a closer and there are 16 guys in the league better than Gregg at not allowing runners on.

Sorry Ruby, but I don't agree with your assessment of 2 shutdown closers in all of baseball and 20 mediocre ones.

[Runnys]

Additionally, Gregg has allowed a runner to reach base in 26 of his 34 appearances (including tonight).

[Runnys]

Also, lets not forget guys like Heath Bell and Joe Nathan who are likely going to miss the playoffs. Then there is also that K-Rod guy. Ruby, just curious, who are your 2 shut down closers and your 20 mediocre ones?

[jeffy]

Are there any decent closers that might be available for trade?

[biggz]

<!--quoteo(post=45873:date=Jun 23 2009, 11:28 PM:name=jeffy)-->QUOTE (jeffy @ Jun 23 2009, 11:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Are there any decent closers that might be available for trade?<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Bell?

0.923 WHIP (1.086 Petco in 17 appearances, 0.636 Away in 12 appearances)

19 saves in 20 opportunities (10 at Home, 9 Away, and BS away)

Why do you do with Gregg in the case we trade for a different closer? In before burn him at a stake.

[jeffy]

<!--quoteo(post=45874:date=Jun 24 2009, 12:07 AM:name=biggz)-->QUOTE (biggz @ Jun 24 2009, 12:07 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=45873:date=Jun 23 2009, 11:28 PM:name=jeffy)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (jeffy @ Jun 23 2009, 11:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Are there any decent closers that might be available for trade?<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Bell?

0.923 WHIP (1.086 Petco in 17 appearances, 0.636 Away in 12 appearances)

19 saves in 20 opportunities (10 at Home, 9 Away, and BS away)

Why do you do with Gregg in the case we trade for a different closer? In before burn him at a stake.
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Yeah, but we had enough trouble trying to get Peavy from the Padres. They'd probably want an arm and a leg for Bell too. Though I would love to have him....

[offcolorpoetry]

At this point, just send Guzman (once he's healthy) out there to close. He can't be any worse.

[Runnys]

I will admit I am pissed at Gregg for losing that game for us. But, that was the first time he had allowed any runs since June 2nd. It happens. Unfortunately, there is not anyone else we can send out there. You can't send Marmol out there because you never know which Marmol you are going to get.

[Coach]

I dont want to spend all day listing the guys that I would rather close than Gregg.

[ruby23]

<!--quoteo(post=45868:date=Jun 23 2009, 10:40 PM:name=ruby23)-->QUOTE (ruby23 @ Jun 23 2009, 10:40 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=45863:date=Jun 23 2009, 10:21 PM:name=Runnys)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Runnys @ Jun 23 2009, 10:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=45858:date=Jun 23 2009, 09:32 PM:name=ruby23)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ruby23 @ Jun 23 2009, 09:32 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=45856:date=Jun 23 2009, 09:23 PM:name=Lance)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Lance @ Jun 23 2009, 09:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Playoffs? With Gregg as a closer? Pshaw.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Ok for fuck's sake, if the Cubs don't make the playoffs, it won't be because of Kevin Gregg. Gimme a fucking break.

There's about 2 lockdown closers out there and about 20 mediocre ones (the category Gregg falls into), there's gonna be about 6-7 teams in the playoffs with mediocre closers.
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I agree with the fact that if the Cubs miss the playoffs it will not be because of Gregg. However Ruby, your statement about the closers and playoff teams is ridiculous. As it stands right now the closers for the playoff teams would be:

Jonathan Papelbon
Mariano Rivera
Fernando Rodney
Frank Francisco/CJ Wilson
Brad Lidge
Ryan Franklin
Jonathan Broxton

The current WC teams in the NL would have Hoffman or Brian Wilson

I would take ANY ONE of those closers over Kevin Gregg. When healthy, Papelbon, Rivera, Francisco, and Broxton are as lock down as it gets. Lidge has had a tough time, but we cannot forget he did not blow a save at all last year. IMO, Gregg is worse that any one of those closers except maybe Rodney and Franklin.
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I'd suggest you look up some statistics.
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Ryan Franklin 17 saves, 1.00 ERA, 0.89 WHIP - 60 games does not make one a shutdown closer - see career numbers
Broxton 17 saves, 2.29 ERA, 0.82 WHIP - yep, he's good
Hoffman 16 saves, 1.31 ERA, 0.77 WHIP - him too
Papelbon 16 saves, 1.80 ERA, 1.40 WHIP - him three
Rivera 15 saves, 3.25 ERA, 1.08 WHIP - Riveria is no longer a shutdown closer, hasn't been for a couple years
Francisco 12 saves, 0.44 ERA, 0.77 WHIP - 60 games does not make one a shutdown closer - see career numbers
Brian Wilson 19 saves, 2.94 ERA, 1.16 WHIP - 60 games does not make one a shutdown closer - see career numbers

You also completely left off 2 other guys from your list. If you actually think there's more than a couple (a hand full maybe) of legitimate shutdown closers in baseball, I dunno what to tell you. There's a few guys at the top and a whole bunch of guys in the middle and few teams without anyone they can call a closer. Is Gregg good? No, he's average . . . like almost every other team's closer.

[ruby23]

<!--quoteo(post=45872:date=Jun 23 2009, 11:02 PM:name=Runnys)-->QUOTE (Runnys @ Jun 23 2009, 11:02 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Also, lets not forget guys like Heath Bell and Joe Nathan who are likely going to miss the playoffs. Then there is also that K-Rod guy. Ruby, just curious, who are your 2 shut down closers and your 20 mediocre ones?<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
K Rod averages 6 BS per year and is on pace to blow 7 this year, same as Gregg.

[Giff]

Rodriguez might be the most overrated player in the entire game.

[ruby23]

<!--quoteo(post=45887:date=Jun 24 2009, 07:19 AM:name=Giff)-->QUOTE (Giff @ Jun 24 2009, 07:19 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Rodriguez might be the most overrated player in the entire game.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Lots of closers are overrated, that's kinda my point. There's a few real good ones and a whole bunch of average ones, we have an average one. We can bitch and moan all we want about Gregg, but the fact of the matter is, the difference between him and a majority of the closers out there is pretty miniscule. On top of that, what closer out there, that the Cubs could acquire would be a significant enough upgrade from Gregg to actually make a difference? The answer is none. Also, when's the last time a team traded for a closer midseason and that closer then led them to a postseason and beyond? I think never. Is Gregg great at closing? No. Is he servicable? Yes. Is he on par with just about every other closer out there? Yep. There always has to be a scapegoat, so I guess he can be it for the next couple of days

[Coach]