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<!--quoteo(post=48526:date=Jul 7 2009, 01:44 PM:name=KBwsb)-->QUOTE (KBwsb @ Jul 7 2009, 01:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=48521:date=Jul 7 2009, 01:32 PM:name=vegascub)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (vegascub @ Jul 7 2009, 01:32 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <!--quotec-->- the team with the better overall record<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
that's what I think it should be.
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Well, that seems to work in every other sport in existence. Maybe MLB could try it.
disclaimers:
Yeah, I know the Super Bowl is held at a neutral site.
Yeah, I know that the two leagues aren't exactly equal, and it's easier to win 95 games in the NL West than it is in the AL East. So what? That hasn't stopped the NBA, NHL, or NFL from using the "best record" to determine home-field.
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I like the best record in interleague play option, but you can't really complain about best record overall for the reasons you indicated.
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<!--quoteo(post=48528:date=Jul 7 2009, 01:47 PM:name=BT)-->QUOTE (BT @ Jul 7 2009, 01:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=48519:date=Jul 7 2009, 01:28 PM:name=Butcher)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Butcher @ Jul 7 2009, 01:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=48514:date=Jul 7 2009, 01:12 PM:name=BT)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BT @ Jul 7 2009, 01:12 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->-I hate it when people complain about the All Star game determining home field advantage when the previous determination was made by RANDOMLY ALTERNATING. It's a crappy system, but it's certainly no worse than what it replaced.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Just because the previous system sucked, doesn't mean this one is any better. I think it's perfectly acceptable to complain when there are viable alternatives not being used.
Here are a couple of ideas that would be far better than the current one:
- the league with the better overall interleague record
- the team with the better overall record
- the team with the better playoff record up to that point (if one team sweeps their way to the World Series, they get home field advantage)
Just something that makes it meaningful. Winner of the All Star game makes very little sense.
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all of those are unworkable, according to Selig. It makes no sense to me either, but there you have it.
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That reminds me... my biggest pet peeve with mlb is Selig
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<!--quoteo(post=48530:date=Jul 7 2009, 01:52 PM:name=KBwsb)-->QUOTE (KBwsb @ Jul 7 2009, 01:52 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=48303:date=Jul 6 2009, 12:59 PM:name=jstraw)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (jstraw @ Jul 6 2009, 12:59 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Oh, well...yeah, the DH...and fix the pitchers mound...and teach the umps how the strike zone works...and shitcan the wildcard and interleague play...and make the word uniform mean UNIFORM...and no artificial turf or domes.
And bring back the dead ball.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Without being a dick, I will say that I respectfully disagree with nearly every one of your suggestions.
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And for my 3rd post in 2 minutes...
I hate umpires calling balls and strikes and also that they think a 94% accuracy rate is acceptable. I also think the strike zone should be called the way it's described the rule book
<!--quoteo-->QUOTE <!--quotec-->1996 - The Strike Zone is expanded on the lower end, moving from the top of the knees to the bottom of the knees.
1988 - "The Strike Zone is that area over home plate the <b>upper limit of which is a horizontal line at the midpoint between the top of the shoulders and the top of the uniform pants</b>, and the lower level is a line at the top of the knees. The Strike Zone shall be determined from the batter's stance as the batter is prepared to swing at a pitched ball."<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
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<!--quoteo(post=48484:date=Jul 7 2009, 09:05 AM:name=ruby23)-->QUOTE (ruby23 @ Jul 7 2009, 09:05 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->I hate the White Sox too, but Chicago can definitely handle 2 teams . . . in all actuality, places like Chicago and New York could actually handle another team.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
L.A could easily handle another team too. Both the Dodgers and the Angels consistently draw league-leading (or close) attendance, and there are certain areas of town (like the West Valley, or Long Beach) that are a long, long way from either stadium.
There's nothing better than to realize that the good things about youth don't end with youth itself. It's a matter of realizing that life can be renewed every day you get out of bed without baggage. It's tough to get there, but it's better than the dark thoughts. -Lance
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<!--quoteo(post=48528:date=Jul 7 2009, 01:47 PM:name=BT)-->QUOTE (BT @ Jul 7 2009, 01:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=48519:date=Jul 7 2009, 01:28 PM:name=Butcher)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Butcher @ Jul 7 2009, 01:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=48514:date=Jul 7 2009, 01:12 PM:name=BT)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BT @ Jul 7 2009, 01:12 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->-I hate it when people complain about the All Star game determining home field advantage when the previous determination was made by RANDOMLY ALTERNATING. It's a crappy system, but it's certainly no worse than what it replaced.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Just because the previous system sucked, doesn't mean this one is any better. I think it's perfectly acceptable to complain when there are viable alternatives not being used.
Here are a couple of ideas that would be far better than the current one:
- the league with the better overall interleague record
- the team with the better overall record
- the team with the better playoff record up to that point (if one team sweeps their way to the World Series, they get home field advantage)
Just something that makes it meaningful. Winner of the All Star game makes very little sense.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
all of those are unworkable, according to Selig. It makes no sense to me either, but there you have it.
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Just so we're clear...
You hate people who complain about the way home field advantage is determined because Selig says the other alternatives are "unworkable?" That's a good enough reason not to complain about it? Or is it just that they old way sucked, too?
Seems like complaining about it should be pretty valid, but that's me.
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<!--quoteo(post=48535:date=Jul 7 2009, 11:58 AM:name=KBwsb)-->QUOTE (KBwsb @ Jul 7 2009, 11:58 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=48484:date=Jul 7 2009, 09:05 AM:name=ruby23)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ruby23 @ Jul 7 2009, 09:05 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->I hate the White Sox too, but Chicago can definitely handle 2 teams . . . in all actuality, places like Chicago and New York could actually handle another team.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
L.A could easily handle another team too. Both the Dodgers and the Angels consistently draw league-leading (or close) attendance, and there are certain areas of town (like the West Valley, or Long Beach) that are a long, long way from either stadium.
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Long Beach is about 10 miles from the Big A, and closer, considering the 22 Fwy that leads to the ballpark starts in eastern Long Beach just a few miles prior.
A third team would not go well here. While the Dodgers draw big numbers, it's because Dodger Stadium is huge, and they often have a third or more of the ballpark empty for that reason, which is fair and not fair at the same time.
Angel Stadium draw similar numbers, but it looks like more because it holds about 12,000 less than Chavez Ravine. Angel fans are more devout in Orange County, and that team means more to that County than any team means in the whole state. Everything over there revolves around Disneyland and the Angels, without hesitation. That doesn't happen in LA because there's so much more than the Dodgers.
That said, the divide of Angel support basically stops at Long Beach, and it's very much a regional divide.
We have 3 teams in Southern California, I don't know where to put another one. A team in the Valley would not do well in my opinion, for transportation reasons, and congestion of teams. There's so many teams and things to do in LA that it's is the hardest city to sell out for sports. The Dodgers draw a physical attendance of about 30,000+ for weeknights, as do the Halos, that would diminish if there were a third team.
The Bay Area has basically struggled with two teams, that would happen if we got a third. I think New York has more of a chance of support, as they could easily put a team in Jersey and have them rival the Phillies/Mets/Yanks.
I hate my pretentious sounding username too.
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Destined, I agree with you on some of those things. Instead of Long Beach, it'd be better to put a new team near Venice Beach, which is definitely a long ways from either stadium, is a highly populated area, and has its own identity...it could be the beach/Hollywood team.
I disagree with you about packing the park. Californians, especially in the L.A. area, just plain like to go to baseball games. As you mentioned, Angel fans are intense and plentiful. And Dodger Stadium consistently draws as many fans as any team in baseball.
And it's not because "Dodger Stadium is huge." For instance, Cleveland's old stadium (before Jacobs) held 80,000, but curiously, they never once beat the Dodgers in attendance.
You're telling me a new team, (call 'em the Hollywood Stars,) with a park near that Beverly Hills/Santa Monica power corridor couldn't make money? I'm gonna have to disagree with you.
There's nothing better than to realize that the good things about youth don't end with youth itself. It's a matter of realizing that life can be renewed every day you get out of bed without baggage. It's tough to get there, but it's better than the dark thoughts. -Lance
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<!--quoteo(post=48536:date=Jul 7 2009, 02:16 PM:name=Butcher)-->QUOTE (Butcher @ Jul 7 2009, 02:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=48528:date=Jul 7 2009, 01:47 PM:name=BT)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BT @ Jul 7 2009, 01:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=48519:date=Jul 7 2009, 01:28 PM:name=Butcher)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Butcher @ Jul 7 2009, 01:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=48514:date=Jul 7 2009, 01:12 PM:name=BT)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BT @ Jul 7 2009, 01:12 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->-I hate it when people complain about the All Star game determining home field advantage when the previous determination was made by RANDOMLY ALTERNATING. It's a crappy system, but it's certainly no worse than what it replaced.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Just because the previous system sucked, doesn't mean this one is any better. I think it's perfectly acceptable to complain when there are viable alternatives not being used.
Here are a couple of ideas that would be far better than the current one:
- the league with the better overall interleague record
- the team with the better overall record
- the team with the better playoff record up to that point (if one team sweeps their way to the World Series, they get home field advantage)
Just something that makes it meaningful. Winner of the All Star game makes very little sense.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
all of those are unworkable, according to Selig. It makes no sense to me either, but there you have it.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Just so we're clear...
You hate people who complain about the way home field advantage is determined because Selig says the other alternatives are "unworkable?" That's a good enough reason not to complain about it? Or is it just that they old way sucked, too?
Seems like complaining about it should be pretty valid, but that's me.
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Apparently we're not clear. When it was random, no one griped. Everyone was perfectly OK with it. When they made it the new way, everyone bitches AS IF they took a completely legitimate process, and fucked it up. They didn't. They took a completely asinine process, and didn't make it much better. The choice is NOT between All Star determination, and best home record determination. The choice is between All Star determination, or hoping your team gets in in an odd or even numbered year.
As of right now, Selig has said multiple times that best record determination is IMPOSSIBLE. As in, never going to happen. He says they can't work the hotel accommodations. I don't fully understand it, but that is his stance. So complaining about it now is roughly the equivalent of complaining that Hendry hasn't traded Kevin Hart for Albert Pujols.
If you would like me to put an asterisk on my peeve, and put in a paragraph about how it is OK for them to gripe about it, but only with the stipulation that they are griping about it because it doesn't live up to their fantasy world where Selig says it IS possible to do it by best record, then I suppose I can, but I was trying to be concise.
I wish that I believed in Fate. I wish I didn't sleep so late. I used to be carried in the arms of cheerleaders.
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I still don't get it.
People aren't allowed to bitch about Selig's stupid decisions because he isn't likely to change his mind about them?
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What's especially absurd is Selig's assertion that that it would be logistically impossible to put on a championship series without knowing far in advance where it's going to be played.
Uh...nobody <i>ever</i> knows, until the final out is made during the LCS. And that determination is sometimes made on the <i>final play</i>. Last year's Series could have just as easily happened in Boston and L.A. instead of Tampa and Philly.
In fact, Boston took their ALCS to game 7.
What am I missing?
There's nothing better than to realize that the good things about youth don't end with youth itself. It's a matter of realizing that life can be renewed every day you get out of bed without baggage. It's tough to get there, but it's better than the dark thoughts. -Lance
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<!--quoteo(post=48542:date=Jul 7 2009, 12:48 PM:name=KBwsb)-->QUOTE (KBwsb @ Jul 7 2009, 12:48 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Destined, I agree with you on some of those things. Instead of Long Beach, it'd be better to put a new team near Venice Beach, which is definitely a long ways from either stadium, is a highly populated area, and has its own identity...it could be the beach/Hollywood team.
I disagree with you about packing the park. Californians, especially in the L.A. area, just plain like to go to baseball games. As you mentioned, Angel fans are intense and plentiful. And Dodger Stadium consistently draws as many fans as any team in baseball.
And it's not because "Dodger Stadium is huge." For instance, Cleveland's old stadium (before Jacobs) held 80,000, but curiously, they never once beat the Dodgers in attendance.
You're telling me a new team, (call 'em the Hollywood Stars,) with a park near that Beverly Hills/Santa Monica power corridor couldn't make money? I'm gonna have to disagree with you.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Granted, I would love to see a team there, and I would definitely support them. They would make money, don't get me wrong. I just think that it would take away from the Dodger's fan base in terms of money.
They wouldn't hurt the Angels one bit, but at some point they have to take away that Hollywood appeal that the Dodgers already have. The Dodger's are Hollywood's team.
But you're right KB, they would make money. Give them a 35,000 seater in Santa Monica and they couldn't really do too bad at all, put them in the AL West, although a rivalry with the Dodgers would be more of a intra-division rivalry goldmine than with the Halos. I'm just skeptical.
EDIT: About the Cleveland thing, Dodger Stadium sells sooo many corporate seats, that every game is 45,000+ in ticket sales, but the physical attendance is much less. You're right about the Mistake by the Lake, but Cleveland isn't the market that LA is on many levels, not just population. They sold out the Jake for years when they were good, but they lack the corporate stranglehold.
I hate my pretentious sounding username too.
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<!--quoteo(post=48544:date=Jul 7 2009, 02:54 PM:name=Butcher)-->QUOTE (Butcher @ Jul 7 2009, 02:54 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->I still don't get it.
People aren't allowed to bitch about Selig's stupid decisions because he isn't likely to change his mind about them?<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes. That's exactly what I mean. People aren't ALLOWED to bitch about Selig's stupid decisions because he won't change his mind. I tried to use 500 words to explain it, but you boiled it down perfectly.
Or I could mean what I said up above and that people who bitch about something that Selig says CAN'T be changed (unless you are a huge fan of alternating years), are a pet peeve of mine. (I could go further into this, and try to explain that 95 percent of the people who are bitching about the all star game determination aren't in fact arguing for an alternative method, but are just bitching about the current one, but I think that would only confuse you further).
I wish that I believed in Fate. I wish I didn't sleep so late. I used to be carried in the arms of cheerleaders.
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<!--quoteo(post=48548:date=Jul 7 2009, 03:15 PM:name=BT)-->QUOTE (BT @ Jul 7 2009, 03:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=48544:date=Jul 7 2009, 02:54 PM:name=Butcher)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Butcher @ Jul 7 2009, 02:54 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->I still don't get it.
People aren't allowed to bitch about Selig's stupid decisions because he isn't likely to change his mind about them?<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes. That's exactly what I mean. People aren't ALLOWED to bitch about Selig's stupid decisions because he won't change his mind. I tried to use 500 words to explain it, but you boiled it down perfectly.
Or I could mean what I said up above and that people who bitch about something that Selig says CAN'T be changed (unless you are a huge fan of alternating years), are a pet peeve of mine. (I could go further into this, and try to explain that 95 percent of the people who are bitching about the all star game determination aren't in fact arguing for an alternative method, but are just bitching about the current one, but I think that would only confuse you further).
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So...because Selig says something "CAN'T" be changed, it means that it is, literally, physically impossible to change it. It would defy all laws of physics and science and would cause a black hole to open up and the universe to swallow itself.
I get it now.
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<!--quoteo(post=48530:date=Jul 7 2009, 01:52 PM:name=KBwsb)-->QUOTE (KBwsb @ Jul 7 2009, 01:52 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=48303:date=Jul 6 2009, 12:59 PM:name=jstraw)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (jstraw @ Jul 6 2009, 12:59 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Oh, well...yeah, the DH...and fix the pitchers mound...and teach the umps how the strike zone works...and shitcan the wildcard and interleague play...and make the word uniform mean UNIFORM...and no artificial turf or domes.
And bring back the dead ball.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Without being a dick, I will say that I respectfully disagree with nearly every one of your suggestions.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It's a purity of baseball vs. viability of baseball thing. I understand that. I've learned to live with all of these things...well, except the dead ball thing.
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Selig is God. Do not question his AUTHORITAY!
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