Zambrano

[rok]

I've reached the conclusion that Z may be unfixable, at least in a Cubs uniform. Watching him pitch yesterday was an unsettling experience. He had very little movement or velocity on his pitches.

[Coach]

<!--quoteo(post=109264:date=Aug 2 2010, 09:19 AM:name=rok)-->QUOTE (rok @ Aug 2 2010, 09:19 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->I've reached the conclusion that Z may be unfixable, at least in a Cubs uniform. Watching him pitch yesterday was an unsettling experience. He had very little movement or velocity on his pitches.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Welcome aboard.
Seriously, Ive never argued the starting rotation/bullpen decisions. Ive only argued that Zambrano is broken, and the signs have been visible for awhile. We just didnt want to see them.

[rok]

<!--quoteo(post=109266:date=Aug 2 2010, 08:48 AM:name=Coach)-->QUOTE (Coach @ Aug 2 2010, 08:48 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=109264:date=Aug 2 2010, 09:19 AM:name=rok)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rok @ Aug 2 2010, 09:19 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->I've reached the conclusion that Z may be unfixable, at least in a Cubs uniform. Watching him pitch yesterday was an unsettling experience. He had very little movement or velocity on his pitches.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Welcome aboard.
Seriously, Ive never argued the starting rotation/bullpen decisions. Ive only argued that Zambrano is broken, and the signs have been visible for awhile. We just didnt want to see them.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
He's always been one of my favorites so I just wanted the organization to give him every opportunity to turn his shit around. It's not even that I feel his career is over. I just believe he and the Cubs would be better off parting ways and starting fresh. It's hard to let go of your (former) ace though, when it doesn't appear we have anyone to fill his shoes, and that was always my biggest fear.

[jstraw]

<!--quoteo(post=109267:date=Aug 2 2010, 08:57 AM:name=rok)-->QUOTE (rok @ Aug 2 2010, 08:57 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=109266:date=Aug 2 2010, 08:48 AM:name=Coach)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Coach @ Aug 2 2010, 08:48 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=109264:date=Aug 2 2010, 09:19 AM:name=rok)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rok @ Aug 2 2010, 09:19 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->I've reached the conclusion that Z may be unfixable, at least in a Cubs uniform. Watching him pitch yesterday was an unsettling experience. He had very little movement or velocity on his pitches.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Welcome aboard.
Seriously, Ive never argued the starting rotation/bullpen decisions. Ive only argued that Zambrano is broken, and the signs have been visible for awhile. We just didnt want to see them.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
He's always been one of my favorites so I just wanted the organization to give him every opportunity to turn his shit around. It's not even that I feel his career is over. I just believe he and the Cubs would be better off parting ways and starting fresh. It's hard to let go of your (former) ace though, when it doesn't appear we have anyone to fill his shoes, and that was always my biggest fear.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

There is zero reason to do anything with him now except to try and identify the mechanical issues and continue to try and rehabilitate his pitching. There's nothing to lose now. If he needs to be traded in the off-season, fine. There's just no reason to give up on him now, and any chance of getting anything for him may depend on not giving up on him now.

[willis]

Yes but the team and Z seem to need a clean break. Watching him saturday and yesterday, velocity is down, but the movement isn't anywhere near what it was. He is throwing meatballs up there. I am just to the point where I have seen all I need to see to know that this is a trainwreck with lots of casualties unless a move is made to part ways. I think a fresh start will rock his world in a good way and it will allow the cubs addition by subtraction.

To the problem of no front line, or even second line SP...that is a big worry. Whereas I thought about 7-10 days ago the pitching staff was solid, everyone other than Lilly gets smoked (including Cashner). And he is bye bye. It all starts with pitching so I hope the guys in the front office have a plan to land a top notch starter.

[rok]

<!--quoteo(post=109272:date=Aug 2 2010, 09:29 AM:name=jstraw)-->QUOTE (jstraw @ Aug 2 2010, 09:29 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=109267:date=Aug 2 2010, 08:57 AM:name=rok)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rok @ Aug 2 2010, 08:57 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=109266:date=Aug 2 2010, 08:48 AM:name=Coach)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Coach @ Aug 2 2010, 08:48 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=109264:date=Aug 2 2010, 09:19 AM:name=rok)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rok @ Aug 2 2010, 09:19 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->I've reached the conclusion that Z may be unfixable, at least in a Cubs uniform. Watching him pitch yesterday was an unsettling experience. He had very little movement or velocity on his pitches.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Welcome aboard.
Seriously, Ive never argued the starting rotation/bullpen decisions. Ive only argued that Zambrano is broken, and the signs have been visible for awhile. We just didnt want to see them.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
He's always been one of my favorites so I just wanted the organization to give him every opportunity to turn his shit around. It's not even that I feel his career is over. I just believe he and the Cubs would be better off parting ways and starting fresh. It's hard to let go of your (former) ace though, when it doesn't appear we have anyone to fill his shoes, and that was always my biggest fear.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

There is zero reason to do anything with him now except to try and identify the mechanical issues and continue to try and rehabilitate his pitching. There's nothing to lose now. If he needs to be traded in the off-season, fine. There's just no reason to give up on him now, and any chance of getting anything for him may depend on not giving up on him now.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Oh I know. What would be the point of discarding him now unless there was something physically wrong with him? And even then, the options would be limited.

[willis]

And I wrote that before I saw Straw's point. If moved now, I wouldn't cry. If he can be semi fixed (which I doubt) then yes, definitely wait until the offseason and hope he is lights out in a couple of his performances.

[Butcher]

Who is going to be our opening day starter in 2011? Dempster? Man...next year is going to suck worse than this year.

[jstraw]

<!--quoteo(post=109282:date=Aug 2 2010, 10:22 AM:name=Butcher)-->QUOTE (Butcher @ Aug 2 2010, 10:22 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Who is going to be our opening day starter in 2011? Dempster? Man...next year is going to suck worse than this year.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Lilly. I have faith in Hendry.

[Coach]

Oliver Perez

[biggz]

Jeff Samardzija

[Jody]

Cashner

[biggz]

<!--quoteo(post=109291:date=Aug 2 2010, 11:10 AM:name=Jody)-->QUOTE (Jody @ Aug 2 2010, 11:10 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Cashner<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

I would not object.

[rok]

<!--quoteo(post=109292:date=Aug 2 2010, 11:12 AM:name=biggz)-->QUOTE (biggz @ Aug 2 2010, 11:12 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=109291:date=Aug 2 2010, 11:10 AM:name=Jody)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jody @ Aug 2 2010, 11:10 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Cashner<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

I would not object.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm starting to have some doubts about him. His stuff is pretty nasty, but his BB totals and lack of more than 2 good pitches (and the fact he relies on his fastball too much) is a bit troubling. I'm fine with him in the rotation, but I need to see more.

[Coldneck]

<!--quoteo(post=109293:date=Aug 2 2010, 12:18 PM:name=rok)-->QUOTE (rok @ Aug 2 2010, 12:18 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=109292:date=Aug 2 2010, 11:12 AM:name=biggz)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (biggz @ Aug 2 2010, 11:12 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=109291:date=Aug 2 2010, 11:10 AM:name=Jody)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jody @ Aug 2 2010, 11:10 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Cashner<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

I would not object.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm starting to have some doubts about him. His stuff is pretty nasty, but his BB totals and lack of more than 2 good pitches (and the fact he relies on his fastball too much) is a bit troubling. I'm fine with him in the rotation, but I need to see more.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I've only seen him a couple of times but it appears that his fastball doesn't have much movement.