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<!--quoteo(post=12426:date=Jan 19 2009, 03:20 PM:name=cherp)-->QUOTE (cherp @ Jan 19 2009, 03:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->My biggest fear is NASCAR/bicycle racing-like advertising...When the jerseys are rented like billboards, that will be a really sad day.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't think that will ever happen.
"I'm not sure I know what ball cheese or crotch rot is, exactly -- or if there is a difference between the two. Don't post photos, please..."
- Butcher
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<!--quoteo(post=12427:date=Jan 19 2009, 03:32 PM:name=Ace)-->QUOTE (Ace @ Jan 19 2009, 03:32 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12424:date=Jan 19 2009, 02:56 PM:name=Coldneck)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Coldneck @ Jan 19 2009, 02:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <!--quotec-->That would *really* suck. It would also ensure that only wealthy people and ticket brokers had season tickets.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I agree. This could actually decrease the cost of tickets on the secondary market if more fall into the hands of ticket scalpers.
<!--quoteo(post=12422:date=Jan 19 2009, 02:41 PM:name=rok)-->QUOTE (rok @ Jan 19 2009, 02:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->That's one of the most despicable ideas ever. I'm all for generating new types of revenue, but this creates instant price inflation and squeezes out a lot of families from ever going to games. It was getting bad enough already. Shit, I already don't go to the ballpark as much as I used to. If this keeps up, I may go just once a season.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I disagree Rok. Inflation is caused by supply and demand. The curve already indicates that season tickets are vastly underpriced. The only people this will effect are season ticket holders. It shouldn't effect the price of tickets in the secondary market. I would argue that <i>most</i> families can't afford season tickets already. Most families will go to a handful of games (maybe just 1 or 2) during the season by purchasing single game tickets when they go on sale, or by purchasing them from the secondary market.
If anything, price on the secondary market will be driven downward because the ticket scalper supply will increase. I believe prices will remain the same though.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah, the scalper supply may increase, but they will be getting those tickets at a higher cost. A cost they'll pass on to the end user.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's what I'm talking about.
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<!--quoteo(post=12444:date=Jan 19 2009, 06:18 PM:name=rok)-->QUOTE (rok @ Jan 19 2009, 06:18 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12427:date=Jan 19 2009, 03:32 PM:name=Ace)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ace @ Jan 19 2009, 03:32 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12424:date=Jan 19 2009, 02:56 PM:name=Coldneck)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Coldneck @ Jan 19 2009, 02:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <!--quotec-->That would *really* suck. It would also ensure that only wealthy people and ticket brokers had season tickets.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I agree. This could actually decrease the cost of tickets on the secondary market if more fall into the hands of ticket scalpers.
<!--quoteo(post=12422:date=Jan 19 2009, 02:41 PM:name=rok)-->QUOTE (rok @ Jan 19 2009, 02:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->That's one of the most despicable ideas ever. I'm all for generating new types of revenue, but this creates instant price inflation and squeezes out a lot of families from ever going to games. It was getting bad enough already. Shit, I already don't go to the ballpark as much as I used to. If this keeps up, I may go just once a season.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I disagree Rok. Inflation is caused by supply and demand. The curve already indicates that season tickets are vastly underpriced. The only people this will effect are season ticket holders. It shouldn't effect the price of tickets in the secondary market. I would argue that <i>most</i> families can't afford season tickets already. Most families will go to a handful of games (maybe just 1 or 2) during the season by purchasing single game tickets when they go on sale, or by purchasing them from the secondary market.
If anything, price on the secondary market will be driven downward because the ticket scalper supply will increase. I believe prices will remain the same though.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah, the scalper supply may increase, but they will be getting those tickets at a higher cost. A cost they'll pass on to the end user.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's what I'm talking about.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
But that's is totally against economic principal. The supply/demand curve will set the price. Supply is fixed, so the demand is what will determine the price of tickets. If scalpers increase their price it will decrease demand and they will be stuck with the tickets. The price will be determined by how much the consumer is willing to pay for the ticket. The face ticket price and personal seat license charges has little to do with secondary market for tickets. Furthermore, if the Cubs raised tickets prices to match demand they could cut the secondary market out altogether because there wouldn't be any profit for the scalpers.
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<!--quoteo(post=12447:date=Jan 19 2009, 06:43 PM:name=Coldneck)-->QUOTE (Coldneck @ Jan 19 2009, 06:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12444:date=Jan 19 2009, 06:18 PM:name=rok)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rok @ Jan 19 2009, 06:18 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12427:date=Jan 19 2009, 03:32 PM:name=Ace)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ace @ Jan 19 2009, 03:32 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12424:date=Jan 19 2009, 02:56 PM:name=Coldneck)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Coldneck @ Jan 19 2009, 02:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <!--quotec-->That would *really* suck. It would also ensure that only wealthy people and ticket brokers had season tickets.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I agree. This could actually decrease the cost of tickets on the secondary market if more fall into the hands of ticket scalpers.
<!--quoteo(post=12422:date=Jan 19 2009, 02:41 PM:name=rok)-->QUOTE (rok @ Jan 19 2009, 02:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->That's one of the most despicable ideas ever. I'm all for generating new types of revenue, but this creates instant price inflation and squeezes out a lot of families from ever going to games. It was getting bad enough already. Shit, I already don't go to the ballpark as much as I used to. If this keeps up, I may go just once a season.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I disagree Rok. Inflation is caused by supply and demand. The curve already indicates that season tickets are vastly underpriced. The only people this will effect are season ticket holders. It shouldn't effect the price of tickets in the secondary market. I would argue that <i>most</i> families can't afford season tickets already. Most families will go to a handful of games (maybe just 1 or 2) during the season by purchasing single game tickets when they go on sale, or by purchasing them from the secondary market.
If anything, price on the secondary market will be driven downward because the ticket scalper supply will increase. I believe prices will remain the same though.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah, the scalper supply may increase, but they will be getting those tickets at a higher cost. A cost they'll pass on to the end user.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's what I'm talking about.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
But that's is totally against economic principal. The supply/demand curve will set the price. Supply is fixed, so the demand is what will determine the price of tickets. If scalpers increase their price it will decrease demand and they will be stuck with the tickets. The price will be determined by how much the consumer is willing to pay for the ticket. The face ticket price and personal seat license charges has little to do with secondary market for tickets. Furthermore, if the Cubs raised tickets prices to match demand they could cut the secondary market out altogether because there wouldn't be any profit for the scalpers.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
In a bubble and selling maize, you are correct.
If Angelo had picked McClellin, I would have been expecting to hear by training camp that kid has stage 4 cancer, is actually 5'2" 142 lbs, is a chick who played in a 7 - 0 defensive scheme who only rotated in on downs which were 3 and 34 yds + so is not expecting to play a down in the NFL until the sex change is complete and she puts on another 100 lbs. + but this is Emery's first pick so he'll get a pass with a bit of questioning. - 1060Ivy
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<!--quoteo(post=12447:date=Jan 19 2009, 06:43 PM:name=Coldneck)-->QUOTE (Coldneck @ Jan 19 2009, 06:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12444:date=Jan 19 2009, 06:18 PM:name=rok)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rok @ Jan 19 2009, 06:18 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12427:date=Jan 19 2009, 03:32 PM:name=Ace)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ace @ Jan 19 2009, 03:32 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12424:date=Jan 19 2009, 02:56 PM:name=Coldneck)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Coldneck @ Jan 19 2009, 02:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <!--quotec-->That would *really* suck. It would also ensure that only wealthy people and ticket brokers had season tickets.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I agree. This could actually decrease the cost of tickets on the secondary market if more fall into the hands of ticket scalpers.
<!--quoteo(post=12422:date=Jan 19 2009, 02:41 PM:name=rok)-->QUOTE (rok @ Jan 19 2009, 02:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->That's one of the most despicable ideas ever. I'm all for generating new types of revenue, but this creates instant price inflation and squeezes out a lot of families from ever going to games. It was getting bad enough already. Shit, I already don't go to the ballpark as much as I used to. If this keeps up, I may go just once a season.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I disagree Rok. Inflation is caused by supply and demand. The curve already indicates that season tickets are vastly underpriced. The only people this will effect are season ticket holders. It shouldn't effect the price of tickets in the secondary market. I would argue that <i>most</i> families can't afford season tickets already. Most families will go to a handful of games (maybe just 1 or 2) during the season by purchasing single game tickets when they go on sale, or by purchasing them from the secondary market.
If anything, price on the secondary market will be driven downward because the ticket scalper supply will increase. I believe prices will remain the same though.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah, the scalper supply may increase, but they will be getting those tickets at a higher cost. A cost they'll pass on to the end user.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's what I'm talking about.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
But that's is totally against economic principal. The supply/demand curve will set the price. Supply is fixed, so the demand is what will determine the price of tickets. If scalpers increase their price it will decrease demand and they will be stuck with the tickets. The price will be determined by how much the consumer is willing to pay for the ticket. The face ticket price and personal seat license charges has little to do with secondary market for tickets. Furthermore, if the Cubs raised tickets prices to match demand they could cut the secondary market out altogether because there wouldn't be any profit for the scalpers.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You're assuming elastic demand to prices under a normal S/D relationship for commodities and such. Cubs ticket demand has proven to be strongly inelastic to prices for the past 25 years. Sorry, but your reasoning doesn't hold up in special cases like these.
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<!--quoteo(post=12484:date=Jan 20 2009, 01:46 AM:name=rok)-->QUOTE (rok @ Jan 20 2009, 01:46 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12447:date=Jan 19 2009, 06:43 PM:name=Coldneck)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Coldneck @ Jan 19 2009, 06:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12444:date=Jan 19 2009, 06:18 PM:name=rok)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rok @ Jan 19 2009, 06:18 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12427:date=Jan 19 2009, 03:32 PM:name=Ace)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ace @ Jan 19 2009, 03:32 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12424:date=Jan 19 2009, 02:56 PM:name=Coldneck)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Coldneck @ Jan 19 2009, 02:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <!--quotec-->That would *really* suck. It would also ensure that only wealthy people and ticket brokers had season tickets.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I agree. This could actually decrease the cost of tickets on the secondary market if more fall into the hands of ticket scalpers.
<!--quoteo(post=12422:date=Jan 19 2009, 02:41 PM:name=rok)-->QUOTE (rok @ Jan 19 2009, 02:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->That's one of the most despicable ideas ever. I'm all for generating new types of revenue, but this creates instant price inflation and squeezes out a lot of families from ever going to games. It was getting bad enough already. Shit, I already don't go to the ballpark as much as I used to. If this keeps up, I may go just once a season.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I disagree Rok. Inflation is caused by supply and demand. The curve already indicates that season tickets are vastly underpriced. The only people this will effect are season ticket holders. It shouldn't effect the price of tickets in the secondary market. I would argue that <i>most</i> families can't afford season tickets already. Most families will go to a handful of games (maybe just 1 or 2) during the season by purchasing single game tickets when they go on sale, or by purchasing them from the secondary market.
If anything, price on the secondary market will be driven downward because the ticket scalper supply will increase. I believe prices will remain the same though.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah, the scalper supply may increase, but they will be getting those tickets at a higher cost. A cost they'll pass on to the end user.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's what I'm talking about.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
But that's is totally against economic principal. The supply/demand curve will set the price. Supply is fixed, so the demand is what will determine the price of tickets. If scalpers increase their price it will decrease demand and they will be stuck with the tickets. The price will be determined by how much the consumer is willing to pay for the ticket. The face ticket price and personal seat license charges has little to do with secondary market for tickets. Furthermore, if the Cubs raised tickets prices to match demand they could cut the secondary market out altogether because there wouldn't be any profit for the scalpers.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You're assuming elastic demand to prices under a normal S/D relationship for commodities and such. Cubs ticket demand has proven to be strongly inelastic to prices for the past 25 years. Sorry, but your reasoning doesn't hold up in special cases like these.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
We'll just have to disagree then. Do you think a fan will be willing to pay more for a ticket just because a ticket scalper had to pay a seat license? The price of the ticket will be determined by demand alone. If it is raining, or the Cubs suck, the ticket prices will go down. If the Cubs are winning and it's a sunny Saturday in July, the ticket prices will be very high. This has nothing to do with what the scalper has invested in the tickets.
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You might both be right. Scalpers can charge more if they'd like, but more and more people, with the Cubs encouragement, are selling (and buying) their tickets on stubhub. In most cases, tickets are sold on a declining price method, in that every day tickets listed have their prices come down, until the price meets demand. So while ticket brokers might transfer the cost of the PSL to the end user with their fixed prices, tickets bought on stubhub will reflect current demand, regardless of what the person selling the ticket paid for it.
I wish that I believed in Fate. I wish I didn't sleep so late. I used to be carried in the arms of cheerleaders.
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<!--quoteo(post=12552:date=Jan 20 2009, 12:27 PM:name=Coldneck)-->QUOTE (Coldneck @ Jan 20 2009, 12:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12484:date=Jan 20 2009, 01:46 AM:name=rok)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rok @ Jan 20 2009, 01:46 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12447:date=Jan 19 2009, 06:43 PM:name=Coldneck)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Coldneck @ Jan 19 2009, 06:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12444:date=Jan 19 2009, 06:18 PM:name=rok)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rok @ Jan 19 2009, 06:18 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12427:date=Jan 19 2009, 03:32 PM:name=Ace)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ace @ Jan 19 2009, 03:32 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12424:date=Jan 19 2009, 02:56 PM:name=Coldneck)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Coldneck @ Jan 19 2009, 02:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <!--quotec-->That would *really* suck. It would also ensure that only wealthy people and ticket brokers had season tickets.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I agree. This could actually decrease the cost of tickets on the secondary market if more fall into the hands of ticket scalpers.
<!--quoteo(post=12422:date=Jan 19 2009, 02:41 PM:name=rok)-->QUOTE (rok @ Jan 19 2009, 02:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->That's one of the most despicable ideas ever. I'm all for generating new types of revenue, but this creates instant price inflation and squeezes out a lot of families from ever going to games. It was getting bad enough already. Shit, I already don't go to the ballpark as much as I used to. If this keeps up, I may go just once a season.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I disagree Rok. Inflation is caused by supply and demand. The curve already indicates that season tickets are vastly underpriced. The only people this will effect are season ticket holders. It shouldn't effect the price of tickets in the secondary market. I would argue that <i>most</i> families can't afford season tickets already. Most families will go to a handful of games (maybe just 1 or 2) during the season by purchasing single game tickets when they go on sale, or by purchasing them from the secondary market.
If anything, price on the secondary market will be driven downward because the ticket scalper supply will increase. I believe prices will remain the same though.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah, the scalper supply may increase, but they will be getting those tickets at a higher cost. A cost they'll pass on to the end user.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's what I'm talking about.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
But that's is totally against economic principal. The supply/demand curve will set the price. Supply is fixed, so the demand is what will determine the price of tickets. If scalpers increase their price it will decrease demand and they will be stuck with the tickets. The price will be determined by how much the consumer is willing to pay for the ticket. The face ticket price and personal seat license charges has little to do with secondary market for tickets. Furthermore, if the Cubs raised tickets prices to match demand they could cut the secondary market out altogether because there wouldn't be any profit for the scalpers.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You're assuming elastic demand to prices under a normal S/D relationship for commodities and such. Cubs ticket demand has proven to be strongly inelastic to prices for the past 25 years. Sorry, but your reasoning doesn't hold up in special cases like these.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
We'll just have to disagree then. Do you think a fan will be willing to pay more for a ticket just because a ticket scalper had to pay a seat license? The price of the ticket will be determined by demand alone. If it is raining, or the Cubs suck, the ticket prices will go down. If the Cubs are winning and it's a sunny Saturday in July, the ticket prices will be very high. This has nothing to do with what the scalper has invested in the tickets.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Dude, I majored in econ, and it strikes me that you're describing the Cubs as though they are a typical commodity. They are NOT. Supply and Demand have pretty much been fixed with regard to the Cubs for the better part of 3 decades, so changes in demand dictate almost nothing in this case. In normal cases (say the White Sox) yes, but not in the case of the Cubs. Prices are dictated by the what the organization believes they should be, and all things being equal, if they decide to add a license fee on top of the existing prices (which I can't imagine will go down), you'd better believe that scalpers will pass along the difference to consumers.
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<!--quoteo(post=12554:date=Jan 20 2009, 12:39 PM:name=BT)-->QUOTE (BT @ Jan 20 2009, 12:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->You might both be right. Scalpers can charge more if they'd like, but more and more people, with the Cubs encouragement, are selling (and buying) their tickets on stubhub. In most cases, tickets are sold on a declining price method, in that every day tickets listed have their prices come down, until the price meets demand. So while ticket brokers might transfer the cost of the PSL to the end user with their fixed prices, tickets bought on stubhub will reflect current demand, regardless of what the person selling the ticket paid for it.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I could be wrong, but most people that buy on StubHub don't wait until the final day of the event to complete a transaction. You're most likely describing a small % of the secondary market.
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If there's a game I want to go to, I find the tickets and pay whatever they are asking for them. I only get to go to 4-5 games a year, so whether a ticket costs me $20 or $50, it's not gonna change my plans at all.
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<!--quoteo(post=12609:date=Jan 20 2009, 06:34 PM:name=rok)-->QUOTE (rok @ Jan 20 2009, 06:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12552:date=Jan 20 2009, 12:27 PM:name=Coldneck)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Coldneck @ Jan 20 2009, 12:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12484:date=Jan 20 2009, 01:46 AM:name=rok)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rok @ Jan 20 2009, 01:46 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12447:date=Jan 19 2009, 06:43 PM:name=Coldneck)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Coldneck @ Jan 19 2009, 06:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12444:date=Jan 19 2009, 06:18 PM:name=rok)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rok @ Jan 19 2009, 06:18 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12427:date=Jan 19 2009, 03:32 PM:name=Ace)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ace @ Jan 19 2009, 03:32 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12424:date=Jan 19 2009, 02:56 PM:name=Coldneck)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Coldneck @ Jan 19 2009, 02:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <!--quotec-->That would *really* suck. It would also ensure that only wealthy people and ticket brokers had season tickets.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I agree. This could actually decrease the cost of tickets on the secondary market if more fall into the hands of ticket scalpers.
<!--quoteo(post=12422:date=Jan 19 2009, 02:41 PM:name=rok)-->QUOTE (rok @ Jan 19 2009, 02:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->That's one of the most despicable ideas ever. I'm all for generating new types of revenue, but this creates instant price inflation and squeezes out a lot of families from ever going to games. It was getting bad enough already. Shit, I already don't go to the ballpark as much as I used to. If this keeps up, I may go just once a season.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I disagree Rok. Inflation is caused by supply and demand. The curve already indicates that season tickets are vastly underpriced. The only people this will effect are season ticket holders. It shouldn't effect the price of tickets in the secondary market. I would argue that <i>most</i> families can't afford season tickets already. Most families will go to a handful of games (maybe just 1 or 2) during the season by purchasing single game tickets when they go on sale, or by purchasing them from the secondary market.
If anything, price on the secondary market will be driven downward because the ticket scalper supply will increase. I believe prices will remain the same though.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah, the scalper supply may increase, but they will be getting those tickets at a higher cost. A cost they'll pass on to the end user.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's what I'm talking about.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
But that's is totally against economic principal. The supply/demand curve will set the price. Supply is fixed, so the demand is what will determine the price of tickets. If scalpers increase their price it will decrease demand and they will be stuck with the tickets. The price will be determined by how much the consumer is willing to pay for the ticket. The face ticket price and personal seat license charges has little to do with secondary market for tickets. Furthermore, if the Cubs raised tickets prices to match demand they could cut the secondary market out altogether because there wouldn't be any profit for the scalpers.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You're assuming elastic demand to prices under a normal S/D relationship for commodities and such. Cubs ticket demand has proven to be strongly inelastic to prices for the past 25 years. Sorry, but your reasoning doesn't hold up in special cases like these.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
We'll just have to disagree then. Do you think a fan will be willing to pay more for a ticket just because a ticket scalper had to pay a seat license? The price of the ticket will be determined by demand alone. If it is raining, or the Cubs suck, the ticket prices will go down. If the Cubs are winning and it's a sunny Saturday in July, the ticket prices will be very high. This has nothing to do with what the scalper has invested in the tickets.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Dude, I majored in econ, and it strikes me that you're describing the Cubs as though they are a typical commodity. They are NOT. Supply and Demand have pretty much been fixed with regard to the Cubs for the better part of 3 decades, so demand dictates almost nothing in this case. In normal cases (say the White Sox) yes, but not in the case of the Cubs. Prices are dictated by the what the organization believes they should be, and all things being equal, if they decide to add a license fee on top of the existing prices (which I can't imagine will go down), you'd better believe that scalpers will pass along the difference to consumers.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Rok, I also majored in econ. You are a smart guy and we aren't going to see eye to eye on this. But I will say that demand is most definitely not fixed. Demand is tied to how well the Cubs play, the weather, pitching matchups, team we're playing and so on. Supply is most definitely fixed. Since tickets are underpriced based on the supply/demand curve (thus a secondary market) than demand is what drives the prices.
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<!--quoteo(post=12614:date=Jan 20 2009, 06:49 PM:name=ruby23)-->QUOTE (ruby23 @ Jan 20 2009, 06:49 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->If there's a game I want to go to, I find the tickets and pay whatever they are asking for them. I only get to go to 4-5 games a year, so whether a ticket costs me $20 or $50, it's not gonna change my plans at all.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
If you are only spending $20 to $50, you better be watching a game in April or somewhere other than Wrigley.
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<!--quoteo(post=12636:date=Jan 20 2009, 06:47 PM:name=Coldneck)-->QUOTE (Coldneck @ Jan 20 2009, 06:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12609:date=Jan 20 2009, 06:34 PM:name=rok)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rok @ Jan 20 2009, 06:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12552:date=Jan 20 2009, 12:27 PM:name=Coldneck)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Coldneck @ Jan 20 2009, 12:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12484:date=Jan 20 2009, 01:46 AM:name=rok)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rok @ Jan 20 2009, 01:46 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12447:date=Jan 19 2009, 06:43 PM:name=Coldneck)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Coldneck @ Jan 19 2009, 06:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12444:date=Jan 19 2009, 06:18 PM:name=rok)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rok @ Jan 19 2009, 06:18 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12427:date=Jan 19 2009, 03:32 PM:name=Ace)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ace @ Jan 19 2009, 03:32 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=12424:date=Jan 19 2009, 02:56 PM:name=Coldneck)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Coldneck @ Jan 19 2009, 02:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <!--quotec-->That would *really* suck. It would also ensure that only wealthy people and ticket brokers had season tickets.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I agree. This could actually decrease the cost of tickets on the secondary market if more fall into the hands of ticket scalpers.
<!--quoteo(post=12422:date=Jan 19 2009, 02:41 PM:name=rok)-->QUOTE (rok @ Jan 19 2009, 02:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->That's one of the most despicable ideas ever. I'm all for generating new types of revenue, but this creates instant price inflation and squeezes out a lot of families from ever going to games. It was getting bad enough already. Shit, I already don't go to the ballpark as much as I used to. If this keeps up, I may go just once a season.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I disagree Rok. Inflation is caused by supply and demand. The curve already indicates that season tickets are vastly underpriced. The only people this will effect are season ticket holders. It shouldn't effect the price of tickets in the secondary market. I would argue that <i>most</i> families can't afford season tickets already. Most families will go to a handful of games (maybe just 1 or 2) during the season by purchasing single game tickets when they go on sale, or by purchasing them from the secondary market.
If anything, price on the secondary market will be driven downward because the ticket scalper supply will increase. I believe prices will remain the same though.
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Yeah, the scalper supply may increase, but they will be getting those tickets at a higher cost. A cost they'll pass on to the end user.
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That's what I'm talking about.
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But that's is totally against economic principal. The supply/demand curve will set the price. Supply is fixed, so the demand is what will determine the price of tickets. If scalpers increase their price it will decrease demand and they will be stuck with the tickets. The price will be determined by how much the consumer is willing to pay for the ticket. The face ticket price and personal seat license charges has little to do with secondary market for tickets. Furthermore, if the Cubs raised tickets prices to match demand they could cut the secondary market out altogether because there wouldn't be any profit for the scalpers.
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You're assuming elastic demand to prices under a normal S/D relationship for commodities and such. Cubs ticket demand has proven to be strongly inelastic to prices for the past 25 years. Sorry, but your reasoning doesn't hold up in special cases like these.
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We'll just have to disagree then. Do you think a fan will be willing to pay more for a ticket just because a ticket scalper had to pay a seat license? The price of the ticket will be determined by demand alone. If it is raining, or the Cubs suck, the ticket prices will go down. If the Cubs are winning and it's a sunny Saturday in July, the ticket prices will be very high. This has nothing to do with what the scalper has invested in the tickets.
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Dude, I majored in econ, and it strikes me that you're describing the Cubs as though they are a typical commodity. They are NOT. Supply and Demand have pretty much been fixed with regard to the Cubs for the better part of 3 decades, so demand dictates almost nothing in this case. In normal cases (say the White Sox) yes, but not in the case of the Cubs. Prices are dictated by the what the organization believes they should be, and all things being equal, if they decide to add a license fee on top of the existing prices (which I can't imagine will go down), you'd better believe that scalpers will pass along the difference to consumers.
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Rok, I also majored in econ. You are a smart guy and we aren't going to see eye to eye on this. But I will say that demand is most definitely not fixed. Demand is tied to how well the Cubs play, the weather, pitching matchups, and so on. <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Really? Could have fooled me. I guess we'll have to agree to disagree then.
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For the last 5+ years, the Cubs have played in front of like 97%+ capacity for the season. It's not really contingent on any of the factors you listed.
This is not some silly theory that's unsupported and deserves being mocked by photos of Xena. ![[Image: ITgoyeg.png]](http://i.imgur.com/ITgoyeg.png)
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<!--quoteo(post=12644:date=Jan 20 2009, 07:52 PM:name=Kid)-->QUOTE (Kid @ Jan 20 2009, 07:52 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->For the last 5+ years, the Cubs have played in front of like 97%+ capacity for the season. It's not really contingent on any of the factors you listed.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The price of ticket is. Go buy a ticket when the Cubs are playing the Bucos. Then go buy a ticket when they are facing the Sox. Report back what you paid for each ticket.
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