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<!--quoteo(post=16729:date=Feb 8 2009, 11:56 AM:name=Andy)-->QUOTE (Andy @ Feb 8 2009, 11:56 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->I find it nearly impossible to believe that no one in the NFL juices. But then again, those that do are given a slap on the wrist. Kind of funny that in baseball, being caught for steroids forever taints your accomplishments and is an indictment toward the entire league. In the NFL, it's basically shrugged at.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah its amazing.
Mike Greenburg was talking about how football can literally do no wrong, stars go to jail, you've had murder trials and juicing and the Mike Vick stuff and shootings and all kinds of stuff and no one gives a fuck.
Then there is baseball where you hear over and over again how the sport is ruined, its pretty ridiculous.
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first off, why is griffey above suspicion? seriously, why does he get a pass? he hit 56 home runs two years in a row right smack dab in the middle of the offensive explosion brought on by roids. why is sosa suspected but not griffey?
secondly, scarey, they weren't juicing for YOUR entertainment. they were juicing for THEIR paychecks and THEIR fame. the fans never crossed thier minds. and are you really serious when you say you hesitate to watch football because it's unhealthy? please.
Wang.
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Yeah...these guys know what they're getting into. I don't feel the slightest bit guilty.
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It is getting past the point that steroids can be swept under the rug by blaming them a small group of players. When discussing steroids in the context of a disliked player, such as Bonds, it is easy to make them out to be much more evil than they actually are.
Steroids are a medical/scientific breakthrough that reduces the effects of aging. There have been many breakthroughs since the Ruth, Marris and Aaron played. Some of the most dramatic are surgeries (tommy john, MCL/ACL), but also dietary supplements, better pain medication and better rehab.
I am not trying to argue that steroids are OK, I just think we need to get beyond discussing them only in terms of good v. evil.
I like you guys a lot.
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<!--quoteo(post=16665:date=Feb 7 2009, 05:08 PM:name=Scarey)-->QUOTE (Scarey @ Feb 7 2009, 05:08 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Every time this steroid issue comes up, I get this shitty feeling.
I love baseball. Love it. I enjoy just sitting and watching the Cubs. Chatting up rumors and trades with friends. Just analyzing each little decision or strategy used within a 9 inning game.
When I think about what an influence steroids have had on this game, I feel like I should disown baseball. I have principles, and no matter how much people tell me to just forget about it or get off my high horse, I can't stand knowing that I'm rooting for people that: 1. Have little faith in their own abilities and 2. Are polluting their own body for MY entertainment.
It sucks.
I can only hope that the game is a lot cleaner than it was. But, I feel like I'm only lying to myself when I think that. I just feel like a hypocrite, but I just love this game and the Cubs too much to do anything else.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
While I certainly understand your feelings, I guess I have to disagree. Because if we go by people not having faith in their own abilities, and are polluting their bodies for your entertainment, I can't:
-Root for any player who EVER took "greenies" or their equivalent. This is rampant. Read "Ball Four", if you haven't already.
-Watch (virtually) any television show or movie with a hot chick in it. Actresses (and actors to a lesser extent) have been sliced, diced, injected, lifted, and suctioned for quite some time, so they can continue to look "hot", and get parts
-Listen to any song in which a musician was forced to toke, drink, or inject, in order to get up in front of an audience.
-watch pretty much any sport in general.
I admire your principals, and I'd like to think that I share them. I just think that if we draw the line at self destruction as the line in the sand, we won't have any popular entertainment to look at.
Oh, and for the record, Bond and ARod, while scummy, are first round HOFers in my book.
I wish that I believed in Fate. I wish I didn't sleep so late. I used to be carried in the arms of cheerleaders.
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A-Rod admitted to it just now, FWIW.
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<!--quoteo(post=16816:date=Feb 9 2009, 01:23 PM:name=The Dude)-->QUOTE (The Dude @ Feb 9 2009, 01:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->A-Rod admitted to it just now, FWIW.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Kind of shocked that he commented so quickly on this. I'm glad he did it thought. Quite frankly, I feel much more reluctant to forgive him for being honest about it.
I think it's complete bull shit that A-Rod gets singled out of a list of 104 people. Curt Schilling is right, release the rest of the list.
FWIW, I still consider A-Rod a HOF'er.
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A-Rod will end up being ok in terms of the HoF and such. Most of the guys who have admitted it seem to be doing ok in the court of public opinion.
It's only those who continue to deny in the face of overwhelming evidence that have completely ruined their legacy.
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<!--quoteo(post=16824:date=Feb 9 2009, 01:12 PM:name=Gad)-->QUOTE (Gad @ Feb 9 2009, 01:12 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->A-Rod will end up being ok in terms of the HoF and such. Most of the guys who have admitted it seem to be doing ok in the court of public opinion.
It's only those who continue to deny in the face of overwhelming evidence that have completely ruined their legacy.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm not so sure. This is A-Rod we're talking about, not Pettite or Giambi. He's going to break Bonds' record and we're going to be talking about this for the next 5-10 years leading up to that. He's also denied using many times, including in front of the nation on 60 Minutes with Katie Couric. Some people are really, really pissed about this. Michael Kay blew the hell up today on his radio show and he's the Yankees broadcaster. People are furious at him, some even more so that he admitted it.
@TheBlogfines
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he made the right move..man up and be done with it.
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I won't ever consider Bonds, or A-Rod for that matter, the home run king.
"If you throw at someone's head, it's very dangerous, because in the head is the brain." -- Pudge Rodriguez to AM 1270 WXYT in Detroit
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<!--quoteo(post=16829:date=Feb 9 2009, 01:32 PM:name=CFOrfan)-->QUOTE (CFOrfan @ Feb 9 2009, 01:32 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->I won't ever consider Bonds, or A-Rod for that matter, the home run king.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
ESPN had a poll a few days ago about who will be the home run king when A-Rod breaks the record. About 70% of the people said Hank Aaron.
@TheBlogfines
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About the HOF, Kurkjian was also saying how he knows a ton of writers that absolutely will not vote for you if you're linked to steroids at all. I'd imagine that would include guys like Sammy who we don't even have any real evidence on. So if you're an admitted user, you're sure as hell not getting their vote.
@TheBlogfines
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<!--quoteo(post=16771:date=Feb 9 2009, 07:20 AM:name=veryzer)-->QUOTE (veryzer @ Feb 9 2009, 07:20 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->first off, why is griffey above suspicion? seriously, why does he get a pass? he hit 56 home runs two years in a row right smack dab in the middle of the offensive explosion brought on by roids. why is sosa suspected but not griffey?<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Exactly. From 96-99 he had seasons of 49, 56, 56, and 48. Three of those seasons were the only of his career where he topped 600 ABs.
Also, I'm not sure why a guy having injury problems means he didn't use steroids.
And I really don't give a shit about the whole steroids thing anyway.
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<!--quoteo(post=16834:date=Feb 9 2009, 02:39 PM:name=Clapp)-->QUOTE (Clapp @ Feb 9 2009, 02:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->About the HOF, Kurkjian was also saying how he knows a ton of writers that absolutely will not vote for you if you're linked to steroids at all. I'd imagine that would include guys like Sammy who we don't even have any real evidence on. So if you're an admitted user, you're sure as hell not getting their vote.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I have a tough time not voting for Sammy when hasn't had any evidence against him yet. He hurt himself when he pulled the "I can't speak english" bullshit on capital hill. Still, no mention of him in the Canseco book, Mitchell report, or anything else.
I'm fully aware I'm a homer and just want to see all former and current cubs come out clean from all of this. [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/cheers.gif[/img]
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