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I'm tired of the discussion and I think everyone basically agrees that there were other/safer/better options than having Fontenot squeeze. What one side of the argument is calling assinine/stupid/retarded, the other is calling a less favorable choice than others, but it just seems like complete semantics to me at this point. I think everyone realizes there were other choices, safer choices, possibly better choices. There's 6 obvious choices up there, pick what you would have done or say what you would have rather done, if your choice isn't up there.
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no one is going to pick squeeze. Probably. I'm Pinella's biggest defender, and I chose "Let Fox Swing Away". I don't' think it's really the point of the discussion.
I wish that I believed in Fate. I wish I didn't sleep so late. I used to be carried in the arms of cheerleaders.
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<!--quoteo(post=53164:date=Jul 29 2009, 02:55 PM:name=BT)-->QUOTE (BT @ Jul 29 2009, 02:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->no one is going to pick squeeze. Probably. I'm Pinella's biggest defender, and I chose "Let Fox Swing Away". I don't' think it's really the point of the discussion.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It's the only point I've ever made. You and Butcher have your own fairy tale argument going on.
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<!--quoteo(post=53166:date=Jul 29 2009, 02:58 PM:name=Coldneck)-->QUOTE (Coldneck @ Jul 29 2009, 02:58 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=53164:date=Jul 29 2009, 02:55 PM:name=BT)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BT @ Jul 29 2009, 02:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->no one is going to pick squeeze. Probably. I'm Pinella's biggest defender, and I chose "Let Fox Swing Away". I don't' think it's really the point of the discussion.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It's the only point I've ever made. You and Butcher have your own fairy tale argument going on.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
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My point has always been that Lou made the wrong move. It's quite simple, really.
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Than our points are the same. BT is arguing something totally different however.
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I voted to squeeze with Fontenot. Clearly Lou was setting shit up for the 13th inning.... and it worked!
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<!--quoteo(post=53177:date=Jul 29 2009, 02:10 PM:name=Butcher)-->QUOTE (Butcher @ Jul 29 2009, 02:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->My point has always been that Lou made the wrong move. It's quite simple, really.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Of course he did. But we're calling the wrong decision, they're calling it the least likely to succeed option or a riskier option. Just because we see it in black and white, doesn't mean everyone else does or even has to. There's a gradient of choices here and I think we all agree where on the gradient the squeeze play falls, we're just calling it 2 different things.
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<!--quoteo(post=53185:date=Jul 29 2009, 02:16 PM:name=ruby23)-->QUOTE (ruby23 @ Jul 29 2009, 02:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=53177:date=Jul 29 2009, 02:10 PM:name=Butcher)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Butcher @ Jul 29 2009, 02:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->My point has always been that Lou made the wrong move. It's quite simple, really.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Of course he did. But we're calling the wrong decision, they're calling it the least likely to succeed option or a riskier option. Just because we see it in black and white, doesn't mean everyone else does or even has to. There's a gradient of choices here and I think we all agree where on the gradient the squeeze play falls, we're just calling it 2 different things.
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Yup. Is there anyone on the board that doesn't think Fox should have been batting?
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<!--quoteo(post=53189:date=Jul 29 2009, 02:19 PM:name=Sandberg)-->QUOTE (Sandberg @ Jul 29 2009, 02:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=53185:date=Jul 29 2009, 02:16 PM:name=ruby23)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ruby23 @ Jul 29 2009, 02:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=53177:date=Jul 29 2009, 02:10 PM:name=Butcher)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Butcher @ Jul 29 2009, 02:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->My point has always been that Lou made the wrong move. It's quite simple, really.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Of course he did. But we're calling the wrong decision, they're calling it the least likely to succeed option or a riskier option. Just because we see it in black and white, doesn't mean everyone else does or even has to. There's a gradient of choices here and I think we all agree where on the gradient the squeeze play falls, we're just calling it 2 different things.
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Yup. Is there anyone on the board that doesn't think Fox should have been batting?
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Exactly.
So why would anyone make the call to:
A) hit Fontenot in that spot
B) have Fontenot attempt a squeeze?
Can anyone can explain that to me? I can't comprehend why anyone, when presented with several options, would ever choose the option that is less likely to succeed.
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<!--quoteo(post=53195:date=Jul 29 2009, 03:23 PM:name=Butcher)-->QUOTE (Butcher @ Jul 29 2009, 03:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Can anyone can explain that to me? I can't comprehend why anyone, when presented with several options, would ever choose the option that is less likely to succeed.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I really can't believe that you feel that way. It's called a gamble, Butch. Most people make decisions like these from time to time. You sound like a character in a romantic comedy where the safe-thinking stuffed shirt eventually gets coaxed into a night of debauchery by a carefree vixen (BT?).
[img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif[/img]
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<!--quoteo(post=53195:date=Jul 29 2009, 02:23 PM:name=Butcher)-->QUOTE (Butcher @ Jul 29 2009, 02:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=53189:date=Jul 29 2009, 02:19 PM:name=Sandberg)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Sandberg @ Jul 29 2009, 02:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=53185:date=Jul 29 2009, 02:16 PM:name=ruby23)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ruby23 @ Jul 29 2009, 02:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=53177:date=Jul 29 2009, 02:10 PM:name=Butcher)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Butcher @ Jul 29 2009, 02:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->My point has always been that Lou made the wrong move. It's quite simple, really.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Of course he did. But we're calling the wrong decision, they're calling it the least likely to succeed option or a riskier option. Just because we see it in black and white, doesn't mean everyone else does or even has to. There's a gradient of choices here and I think we all agree where on the gradient the squeeze play falls, we're just calling it 2 different things.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yup. Is there anyone on the board that doesn't think Fox should have been batting?
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Exactly.
So why would anyone make the call to:
A) hit Fontenot in that spot
[img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/cool.gif[/img] have Fontenot attempt a squeeze?
Can anyone can explain that to me? I can't comprehend why anyone, when presented with several options, would ever choose the option that is less likely to succeed.
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Lots of reasons.
-element of surprise
-managers gut instinct
-we might be wrong.
Last night, Lou pinch hit for Fontenot. Great move. But I can't think of a single reason why he would hit Johnson instead of Baker. Baker hits right handed, can play second without burning a guy, and has probably as good of a chance to get a hit as Johnson. Putting Johnson in was the "wrong" move. Johnson proceeded to hit a 2 run single, which at the time was huge.
Baseball isn't 100 percent about the numbers.
I wish that I believed in Fate. I wish I didn't sleep so late. I used to be carried in the arms of cheerleaders.
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<!--quoteo(post=53226:date=Jul 29 2009, 02:47 PM:name=BT)-->QUOTE (BT @ Jul 29 2009, 02:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=53195:date=Jul 29 2009, 02:23 PM:name=Butcher)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Butcher @ Jul 29 2009, 02:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=53189:date=Jul 29 2009, 02:19 PM:name=Sandberg)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Sandberg @ Jul 29 2009, 02:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=53185:date=Jul 29 2009, 02:16 PM:name=ruby23)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ruby23 @ Jul 29 2009, 02:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=53177:date=Jul 29 2009, 02:10 PM:name=Butcher)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Butcher @ Jul 29 2009, 02:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->My point has always been that Lou made the wrong move. It's quite simple, really.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Of course he did. But we're calling the wrong decision, they're calling it the least likely to succeed option or a riskier option. Just because we see it in black and white, doesn't mean everyone else does or even has to. There's a gradient of choices here and I think we all agree where on the gradient the squeeze play falls, we're just calling it 2 different things.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yup. Is there anyone on the board that doesn't think Fox should have been batting?
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Exactly.
So why would anyone make the call to:
A) hit Fontenot in that spot
B) have Fontenot attempt a squeeze?
Can anyone can explain that to me? I can't comprehend why anyone, when presented with several options, would ever choose the option that is less likely to succeed.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Lots of reasons.
-element of surprise
-managers gut instinct
-we might be wrong.
Last night, Lou pinch hit for Fontenot. Great move. But I can't think of a single reason why he would hit Johnson instead of Baker. Baker hits right handed, can play second without burning a guy, and has probably as good of a chance to get a hit as Johnson. Putting Johnson in was the "wrong" move. Johnson proceeded to hit a 2 run single, which at the time was huge.
Baseball isn't 100 percent about the numbers.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Results don't prove whether it was the right choice or not. The squeeze play not working doesn't prove that it was the wrong choice, just like Johnson hitting the 2 run single doesn't prove it was the right choice.
Every so often, a completely idiotic move is going to work out in your favor. It doesn't mean you should continue to make idiotic moves because every so often it actually works.
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The point is, if we took a poll and said should Lou pinch hit Johnson or Baker, I would have chosen Baker. Which would prove nothing. Johnson wasn't the "wrong" choice, just because I said so.
I wish that I believed in Fate. I wish I didn't sleep so late. I used to be carried in the arms of cheerleaders.
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<!--quoteo(post=53234:date=Jul 29 2009, 03:02 PM:name=BT)-->QUOTE (BT @ Jul 29 2009, 03:02 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->The point is, if we took a poll and said should Lou pinch hit Johnson or Baker, I would have chosen Baker. Which would prove nothing. Johnson wasn't the "wrong" choice, just because I said so.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
OK. That's fine. But if you looked at matchups, averages, blah, blah, blah, and the numbers say that Baker should hit instead of Johnson, choosing Johnson would have been the wrong move.
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