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<!--quoteo(post=99781:date=Jun 3 2010, 04:27 PM:name=rok)-->QUOTE (rok @ Jun 3 2010, 04:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Regardless of where it ends up, the new facility is going to be top notch.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This.
And most players, scouts, etc. are on record saying that the AZ experience is more beneficial to the teams than Florida. The two obvious reasons are weather (it rains often in FL, almost never in AZ), and the 2-3 hour drives between cities in FL. As Butch said, in AZ, every team trains in the Phx area...even the 2 Tucson teams have moved up to Phx.
Unless you think that it's more beneficial for the players to sit on a bus for lots of hours instead of working out on a baseball field, it's hard to imagine a reason for choosing Florida.
There's nothing better than to realize that the good things about youth don't end with youth itself. It's a matter of realizing that life can be renewed every day you get out of bed without baggage. It's tough to get there, but it's better than the dark thoughts. -Lance
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It is sounding more and more like it is a done deal. I also find the final two blurbs ironic because the Sox and others, again, were the biggest crusaders against local efforts, yet the were able to push tax and fee increases through to publicly fund their facilities in Glendale and Scottsdale.
http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/n...inance0604.html
<!--quoteo-->QUOTE <!--quotec-->Mesa plans to use 11,000 acres of farmland it owns in Pinal County to obtain financing.
"We want to make it very clear: Mesa will deliver on the stadium," City Manager Chris Brady said. "At the end of the day, everything gets built. We have the financial plan to make that happen."<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo-->QUOTE <!--quotec-->The team and the city have a history that goes back more than 50 years, but the clock is ticking for a deal. Earlier this year, the Cubs agreed to an exclusive negotiating agreement with Mesa, keeping the Florida suitors at bay and giving the city until July 12 to come up with a way to finance the new training facility.
Mesa bought the Pinal County farmland 25 years ago for its water rights, but with water available from other sources, the land is no longer needed. So, the city could gradually sell off the property as market prices improve and use the money to pay off stadium loans.
Mayor Scott Smith said he still hopes legislation will emerge during next year's session to fix cracks emerging in the Cactus League's financial underpinnings.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo-->QUOTE <!--quotec-->Smith said Mesa will not ask voters in November to approve bonds to pay for the city's share of the project but will rely on funding secured from the value of the farmland, which is near Coolidge.
<b>However, voters will be asked to approve an increase in the bed tax to 5 percent from 3 percent, bringing it in line with recent hikes in Scottsdale and Tempe.</b> The $1 million increase in projected annual revenue from the bed tax would be applied toward stadium construction.
Mesa's city charter requires voters to approve any expenditure on a sports facility of more than $1.5 million, so a second ballot question will appear in November. The City Council would need to vote to put such a referendum on the ballot.
The Cubs have been asking for new training facilities since Glendale and Goodyear built state-of-the art stadiums and practice complexes.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
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<!--quoteo(post=99771:date=Jun 3 2010, 02:55 PM:name=rok)-->QUOTE (rok @ Jun 3 2010, 02:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99769:date=Jun 3 2010, 02:53 PM:name=veryzer)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (veryzer @ Jun 3 2010, 02:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99767:date=Jun 3 2010, 02:43 PM:name=rok)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rok @ Jun 3 2010, 02:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->I have no idea what is going to happen, since times are so tough and politically, it is very unpopular right now to push through tax and fee increases for any reason other than in the event of a budgetary doomsday scenario, but I hope the team remains in AZ. I hate it when traditions are destroyed especially in sports, and it would be absolutely devastating to the local economy if the Cubs were to jump ship after more than 50 years in the state. Mesa needs the source of revenue way more than Naples does, so I am rooting for the status quo.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
When the tradition is bad, I'm all for destroying it, with extreme prejudice. Cubs tradition is bad. Blow it all up.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't disagree, and when it comes to Wrigley itself, I actually wouldn't mind rebuilding the place brick by brick, but I don't think the location of our ST facilities has anything to do with the 102 years of nothingness.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't think it does either, but if you're keeping the Cubs in Arizona for nothing other than tradition, and the tradition is as bad as the Cubs, why bother? I don't care where they have Spring Training.
Wang.
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<!--quoteo(post=99837:date=Jun 4 2010, 10:24 AM:name=veryzer)-->QUOTE (veryzer @ Jun 4 2010, 10:24 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99771:date=Jun 3 2010, 02:55 PM:name=rok)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rok @ Jun 3 2010, 02:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99769:date=Jun 3 2010, 02:53 PM:name=veryzer)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (veryzer @ Jun 3 2010, 02:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99767:date=Jun 3 2010, 02:43 PM:name=rok)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rok @ Jun 3 2010, 02:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->I have no idea what is going to happen, since times are so tough and politically, it is very unpopular right now to push through tax and fee increases for any reason other than in the event of a budgetary doomsday scenario, but I hope the team remains in AZ. I hate it when traditions are destroyed especially in sports, and it would be absolutely devastating to the local economy if the Cubs were to jump ship after more than 50 years in the state. Mesa needs the source of revenue way more than Naples does, so I am rooting for the status quo.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
When the tradition is bad, I'm all for destroying it, with extreme prejudice. Cubs tradition is bad. Blow it all up.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't disagree, and when it comes to Wrigley itself, I actually wouldn't mind rebuilding the place brick by brick, but I don't think the location of our ST facilities has anything to do with the 102 years of nothingness.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't think it does either, but if you're keeping the Cubs in Arizona for nothing other than tradition, and the tradition is as bad as the Cubs, why bother? I don't care where they have Spring Training.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
But it isn't just about tradition though. The local economy needs the team there and already have an established fanbase that supports them. On the other hand, Naples is an ultra-wealthy mostly retirement community that doesn't need the team. I'd say all else isn't equal aside from the facilities that will be the best in baseball regardless of where the team plays.
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<!--quoteo(post=99838:date=Jun 4 2010, 11:27 AM:name=rok)-->QUOTE (rok @ Jun 4 2010, 11:27 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99837:date=Jun 4 2010, 10:24 AM:name=veryzer)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (veryzer @ Jun 4 2010, 10:24 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99771:date=Jun 3 2010, 02:55 PM:name=rok)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rok @ Jun 3 2010, 02:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99769:date=Jun 3 2010, 02:53 PM:name=veryzer)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (veryzer @ Jun 3 2010, 02:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99767:date=Jun 3 2010, 02:43 PM:name=rok)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rok @ Jun 3 2010, 02:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->I have no idea what is going to happen, since times are so tough and politically, it is very unpopular right now to push through tax and fee increases for any reason other than in the event of a budgetary doomsday scenario, but I hope the team remains in AZ. I hate it when traditions are destroyed especially in sports, and it would be absolutely devastating to the local economy if the Cubs were to jump ship after more than 50 years in the state. Mesa needs the source of revenue way more than Naples does, so I am rooting for the status quo.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
When the tradition is bad, I'm all for destroying it, with extreme prejudice. Cubs tradition is bad. Blow it all up.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't disagree, and when it comes to Wrigley itself, I actually wouldn't mind rebuilding the place brick by brick, but I don't think the location of our ST facilities has anything to do with the 102 years of nothingness.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't think it does either, but if you're keeping the Cubs in Arizona for nothing other than tradition, and the tradition is as bad as the Cubs, why bother? I don't care where they have Spring Training.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
But it isn't just about tradition though. The local economy needs the team there and already have an established fanbase that supports them. On the other hand, Naples is an ultra-wealthy mostly retirement community that doesn't need the team. I'd say all else isn't equal aside from the facilities that will be the best in baseball regardless of where the team plays.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
With the crash of the economy, Naples is in real bad shape too. Just check out some of the neighborhoods and country clubs that have gone bankrupt in the last couple or years. But Rok is right, Naples = old rich folk while Mesa is more of a common man place.
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No offense, but I could care less about the economical impact for the community where it is located.
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<!--quoteo(post=99859:date=Jun 4 2010, 12:15 PM:name=Coach)-->QUOTE (Coach @ Jun 4 2010, 12:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->No offense, but I could care less about the economical impact for the community where it is located.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
None taken, but the cost/benefit between AZ and FLA is really lopsided otherwise, especially considering that the facilities would be virtually the same. I'm not trying to convince anyone to care, but it's hard for me to give a shit about Naples when they have nothing to lose, while Mesa has everything to lose. That's just me though, but everyone is entitled to feel however they want.
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<!--quoteo(post=99862:date=Jun 4 2010, 01:53 PM:name=rok)-->QUOTE (rok @ Jun 4 2010, 01:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99859:date=Jun 4 2010, 12:15 PM:name=Coach)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Coach @ Jun 4 2010, 12:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->No offense, but I could care less about the economical impact for the community where it is located.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
None taken, but the cost/benefit between AZ and FLA is really lopsided otherwise, especially considering that the facilities would be virtually the same. I'm not trying to convince anyone to care, but it's hard for me to give a shit about Naples when they have nothing to lose, while Mesa has everything to lose. That's just me though, but everyone is entitled to feel however they want.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
If all else were equal, I would prefer Florida because it would be closer to me geographically.
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<!--quoteo(post=99864:date=Jun 4 2010, 01:07 PM:name=Coach)-->QUOTE (Coach @ Jun 4 2010, 01:07 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99862:date=Jun 4 2010, 01:53 PM:name=rok)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rok @ Jun 4 2010, 01:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99859:date=Jun 4 2010, 12:15 PM:name=Coach)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Coach @ Jun 4 2010, 12:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->No offense, but I could care less about the economical impact for the community where it is located.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
None taken, but the cost/benefit between AZ and FLA is really lopsided otherwise, especially considering that the facilities would be virtually the same. I'm not trying to convince anyone to care, but it's hard for me to give a shit about Naples when they have nothing to lose, while Mesa has everything to lose. That's just me though, but everyone is entitled to feel however they want.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
If all else were equal, I would prefer Florida because it would be closer to me geographically.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
We know that.
If Angelo had picked McClellin, I would have been expecting to hear by training camp that kid has stage 4 cancer, is actually 5'2" 142 lbs, is a chick who played in a 7 - 0 defensive scheme who only rotated in on downs which were 3 and 34 yds + so is not expecting to play a down in the NFL until the sex change is complete and she puts on another 100 lbs. + but this is Emery's first pick so he'll get a pass with a bit of questioning. - 1060Ivy
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<!--quoteo(post=99859:date=Jun 4 2010, 12:15 PM:name=Coach)-->QUOTE (Coach @ Jun 4 2010, 12:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->No offense, but I could care less about the economical impact for the community where it is located.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Took the words right from my face.
And especially in a racist ass state like Arizona. I'd love it if every team left that ass backwards state.
Wang.
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<!--quoteo(post=99875:date=Jun 4 2010, 01:42 PM:name=veryzer)-->QUOTE (veryzer @ Jun 4 2010, 01:42 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99859:date=Jun 4 2010, 12:15 PM:name=Coach)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Coach @ Jun 4 2010, 12:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->No offense, but I could care less about the economical impact for the community where it is located.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Took the words right from my face.
And especially in a racist ass state like Arizona. I'd love it if every team left that ass backwards state.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah...Florida doesn't have much baggage.
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<!--quoteo(post=99881:date=Jun 4 2010, 01:48 PM:name=Butcher)-->QUOTE (Butcher @ Jun 4 2010, 01:48 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99875:date=Jun 4 2010, 01:42 PM:name=veryzer)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (veryzer @ Jun 4 2010, 01:42 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99859:date=Jun 4 2010, 12:15 PM:name=Coach)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Coach @ Jun 4 2010, 12:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->No offense, but I could care less about the economical impact for the community where it is located.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Took the words right from my face.
And especially in a racist ass state like Arizona. I'd love it if every team left that ass backwards state.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah...Florida doesn't have much baggage.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well true........i can't argue that, but AZ seems worse, at least on a racial scale. Remember when they wouldn't recognize MLK day as a national holiday? And now this racial profiling shit makes me wonder about that state.
In the end, it doesn't matter to me where they have spring training. I just don't think tradition and the economic status of people I don't know are good enough reasons to keep a team anywhere.
Wang.
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I'm glad we aren't the ones making the decision.
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All this push from local politicians for the California teams to leave Arizona over that law, is fucking ridiculous. If the Cubs left for that reason, I would disappointed in the franchise for letting such a petty political reason affect a ballclub.
I hate my pretentious sounding username too.
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<!--quoteo(post=99956:date=Jun 4 2010, 07:21 PM:name=Destined)-->QUOTE (Destined @ Jun 4 2010, 07:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->All this push from local politicians for the California teams to leave Arizona over that law, is fucking ridiculous. If the Cubs left for that reason, I would disappointed in the franchise for letting such a petty political reason affect a ballclub.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
[1960]Yeah, why should anybody boycott the South because of Jim Crow laws? The South has a problem and it's trying to deal with it. Any boycott is just a petty political action.[/1960]
Fortunately, the law will be struck down in short order (not only for violating Equal Protection, but for violating the Supremacy Clause).
This is not some silly theory that's unsupported and deserves being mocked by photos of Xena. ![[Image: ITgoyeg.png]](http://i.imgur.com/ITgoyeg.png)
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