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<!--quoteo(post=60347:date=Aug 27 2009, 10:21 AM:name=veryzer)-->QUOTE (veryzer @ Aug 27 2009, 10:21 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=60340:date=Aug 27 2009, 10:09 AM:name=BT)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BT @ Aug 27 2009, 10:09 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->I'm still trying to understand something here. Again, if a guy is being racist, it doesn't matter if every single person in the stands agrees with him. If he is being loud enough for a player to hear it, he must be loud enough for security to hear it, right? Especially in the bleachers. IIRC there is security in either every aisle, or every other aisle. How are they missing this?
I'm not doubting there are racist Cub fans. I am doubting that they are stupid enough to broadcast their racism in front of 40,000 people, and clever enough to avoid security while doing it.
To put it another way, I am more than happy (and very likely) to be calling Theriot a stupid fucking cocksucker in the confines of my home. But I wouldn't dream of screaming that at him while I sit in the stands.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
dude, because cubs security is racist. get it? the whole cub organization is racist. i know this because hawkins, jones, and bradley, three players with questionable character themselves, say so.
in fact, kid and scarey have convinced me that cub fans are racist. not white sox fans, a team from the same city, not twins fans, not rangers fans, just cub fans. i mean, i've never heard racial slurs shouted at wrigley, but if kid and scarey say it happens all the time, then who am i to argue that? cub fans are racist.
and nevermind the fact that all the players complaining about the rampant racism all did so at a time when they were shitting their beds and fans were letting them have it. nevermind the fact that if any of these players would have actually earned all the money they were given, none of this would be an issue, nevermind the fact that the most beloved player to ever wear a cub uniform is indeed black (i think he has a statue outside the park), nevermind the fact that the most popular player on the team is black, nevermind the fact that todd hundley (one of the most despised cubs ever) is white, nevermind the fact that not a single latino player has ever complained of racism. i'm convinced. cub fans are racist. i know this because a handful of ass clown worthless players, a manager who never took responsibility for a single thing he ever did wrong, and kid who as far as i know hasn't been to wrigley in years if ever, and scarey say so.
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Way to completely misrepresent what we were saying. In fact, we were so careful to guard against what you're implying. Yes, I realize it was hyperbole, but it was hyperbole with a directive... and that directive is so far off I can't really quantify the degree that it's off by.
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<!--quoteo(post=60343:date=Aug 27 2009, 10:13 AM:name=Scarey)-->QUOTE (Scarey @ Aug 27 2009, 10:13 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=60340:date=Aug 27 2009, 10:09 AM:name=BT)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BT @ Aug 27 2009, 10:09 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->I'm still trying to understand something here. Again, if a guy is being racist, it doesn't matter if every single person in the stands agrees with him. If he is being loud enough for a player to hear it, he must be loud enough for security to hear it, right? Especially in the bleachers. IIRC there is security in either every aisle, or every other aisle. How are they missing this?
I'm not doubting there are racist Cub fans. I am doubting that they are stupid enough to broadcast their racism in front of 40,000 people, and clever enough to avoid security while doing it.
To put it another way, I am more than happy (and very likely) to be calling Theriot a stupid fucking cocksucker in the confines of my home. But I wouldn't dream of screaming that at him while I sit in the stands.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Did you not see the dumbfuck that threw beer on Victorino? And that guy didn't even get caught initially, so there goes the theory that security/other fans would take care of the problem. Fans do stupid things and get away with them. I've been in the bleachers while people have said some really nasty things to the opposing players. Not racist, but sexual which can be as bad or worse IMO.
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I'm not following your argument. A dumbfuck threw beer on Victorino. And security was all over him within seconds. The fact that they got the wrong guy proves nothing, other than it's difficult to figure out one perpetrator in a large group. If your argument is that security might not be able to tell which specific person is shouting slurs, I might agree. But the fact that security narrowed down who threw the beer within 2 seats of the perpetrator and within 10 seconds of the event would seem to prove my point, rather than dispute it.
furthermore, I think you are also proving my point when you related your experience. I have no doubt that people will feel comfortable shouting nasty sexual things to a player in a crowd in 2009. I have severe doubts they will feel comfortable screaming the N word (i can't even type it in context) in a crowd in 2009. Your experience seems to support that.
I wish that I believed in Fate. I wish I didn't sleep so late. I used to be carried in the arms of cheerleaders.
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NM double post.
I wish that I believed in Fate. I wish I didn't sleep so late. I used to be carried in the arms of cheerleaders.
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<!--quoteo(post=60361:date=Aug 27 2009, 11:50 AM:name=BT)-->QUOTE (BT @ Aug 27 2009, 11:50 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=60343:date=Aug 27 2009, 10:13 AM:name=Scarey)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Scarey @ Aug 27 2009, 10:13 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=60340:date=Aug 27 2009, 10:09 AM:name=BT)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BT @ Aug 27 2009, 10:09 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->I'm still trying to understand something here. Again, if a guy is being racist, it doesn't matter if every single person in the stands agrees with him. If he is being loud enough for a player to hear it, he must be loud enough for security to hear it, right? Especially in the bleachers. IIRC there is security in either every aisle, or every other aisle. How are they missing this?
I'm not doubting there are racist Cub fans. I am doubting that they are stupid enough to broadcast their racism in front of 40,000 people, and clever enough to avoid security while doing it.
To put it another way, I am more than happy (and very likely) to be calling Theriot a stupid fucking cocksucker in the confines of my home. But I wouldn't dream of screaming that at him while I sit in the stands.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Did you not see the dumbfuck that threw beer on Victorino? And that guy didn't even get caught initially, so there goes the theory that security/other fans would take care of the problem. Fans do stupid things and get away with them. I've been in the bleachers while people have said some really nasty things to the opposing players. Not racist, but sexual which can be as bad or worse IMO.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm not following your argument. A dumbfuck threw beer on Victorino. And security was all over him within seconds. The fact that they got the wrong guy proves nothing, other than it's difficult to figure out one perpetrator in a large group. If your argument is that security might not be able to tell which specific person is shouting slurs, I might agree. But the fact that security narrowed down who threw the beer within 2 seats of the perpetrator and within 10 seconds of the event would seem to prove my point, rather than dispute it.
furthermore, I think you are also proving my point when you related your experience. I have no doubt that people will feel comfortable shouting nasty sexual things to a player in a crowd in 2009. I have severe doubts they will feel comfortable screaming the N word (i can't even type it in context) in a crowd in 2009. Your experience seems to support that.
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I think I've typed multiple times that nobody is saying the N word. Nobody. Nobody is screaming the N word.
Nobody.
No
body
.
But, if someone says something about watermellon, or chicken wings, or says something about being a a hispanic player being a landscaper, or an Asian player not knowing how to drive or have buck teeth... I don't think people are gonna jump on the person. As I said, everyone's going to feel uncomfortable and pretend it didn't happen.
Racial slurs don't emcompass one freaking word.
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<!--quoteo(post=60363:date=Aug 27 2009, 12:17 PM:name=Scarey)-->QUOTE (Scarey @ Aug 27 2009, 12:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=60361:date=Aug 27 2009, 11:50 AM:name=BT)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BT @ Aug 27 2009, 11:50 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=60343:date=Aug 27 2009, 10:13 AM:name=Scarey)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Scarey @ Aug 27 2009, 10:13 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=60340:date=Aug 27 2009, 10:09 AM:name=BT)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BT @ Aug 27 2009, 10:09 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->I'm still trying to understand something here. Again, if a guy is being racist, it doesn't matter if every single person in the stands agrees with him. If he is being loud enough for a player to hear it, he must be loud enough for security to hear it, right? Especially in the bleachers. IIRC there is security in either every aisle, or every other aisle. How are they missing this?
I'm not doubting there are racist Cub fans. I am doubting that they are stupid enough to broadcast their racism in front of 40,000 people, and clever enough to avoid security while doing it.
To put it another way, I am more than happy (and very likely) to be calling Theriot a stupid fucking cocksucker in the confines of my home. But I wouldn't dream of screaming that at him while I sit in the stands.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Did you not see the dumbfuck that threw beer on Victorino? And that guy didn't even get caught initially, so there goes the theory that security/other fans would take care of the problem. Fans do stupid things and get away with them. I've been in the bleachers while people have said some really nasty things to the opposing players. Not racist, but sexual which can be as bad or worse IMO.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm not following your argument. A dumbfuck threw beer on Victorino. And security was all over him within seconds. The fact that they got the wrong guy proves nothing, other than it's difficult to figure out one perpetrator in a large group. If your argument is that security might not be able to tell which specific person is shouting slurs, I might agree. But the fact that security narrowed down who threw the beer within 2 seats of the perpetrator and within 10 seconds of the event would seem to prove my point, rather than dispute it.
furthermore, I think you are also proving my point when you related your experience. I have no doubt that people will feel comfortable shouting nasty sexual things to a player in a crowd in 2009. I have severe doubts they will feel comfortable screaming the N word (i can't even type it in context) in a crowd in 2009. Your experience seems to support that.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I think I've typed multiple times that nobody is saying the N word. Nobody. Nobody is screaming the N word.
Nobody.
No
body
.
But, if someone says something about watermellon, or chicken wings, or says something about being a a hispanic player being a landscaper, or an Asian player not knowing how to drive or have buck teeth... I don't think people are gonna jump on the person. As I said, everyone's going to feel uncomfortable and pretend it didn't happen.
Racial slurs don't emcompass one freaking word.
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scarey, i am 100% sure that if someone made "watermelon" comment or a "chicken" comment or a "big lip" comment or any other racial slur, they'd be dealt with as quickly and as severely as if they dropped the n-word. i'd bet my life on it.
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Relax. I never said it did encompass one word.
And I'd still be surprised if someone is screaming at Milton Bradley to come eat some fried chicken and watermelon. And if they did, Bradley should tell us what was said. Because, frankly, leaving it open ended leaves the bleachers open to accusations of all kind.
I wish that I believed in Fate. I wish I didn't sleep so late. I used to be carried in the arms of cheerleaders.
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<!--quoteo(post=60366:date=Aug 27 2009, 12:40 PM:name=BT)-->QUOTE (BT @ Aug 27 2009, 12:40 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Relax. I never said it did encompass one word.
And I'd still be surprised if someone is screaming at Milton Bradley to come eat some fried chicken and watermelon. And if they did, Bradley should tell us what was said. Because, frankly, leaving it open ended leaves the bleachers open to accusations of all kind.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
the fact that he won't be specific at all tells me he's full of shit. consider the source. hawkins, jones, bradley, and baker....douchebags all. they all came here and failed, the fans told them so, and they pulled the race card. the sun-times fuels that fire. bradley read that article before he played a single game here and he grasped on to it like a life jacket.
Wang.
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I still don't understand why you guys think that this has never happened where the fan was escorted out by security.
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The bottom line for me is not whether Cubs fans are racist it's that this is playing out just like Jones and Hawkins and now we have to patiently count the days until Bradly is some other team's problem...which sucks.
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<!--quoteo(post=60368:date=Aug 27 2009, 12:44 PM:name=Scarey)-->QUOTE (Scarey @ Aug 27 2009, 12:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->I still don't understand why you guys think that this has never happened where the fan was escorted out by security.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
i'm sure it has happened. i'm sure it's happened in every arena and stadium in america. i'm also sure they were isolated incidents and aren't indicative of what happens at wrigley on a daily basis.
Wang.
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<!--quoteo(post=60368:date=Aug 27 2009, 12:44 PM:name=Scarey)-->QUOTE (Scarey @ Aug 27 2009, 12:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->I still don't understand why you guys think that this has never happened where the fan was escorted out by security.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
what are you talking about? Are you saying a fan was escorted out for shouting racial slurs?
I wish that I believed in Fate. I wish I didn't sleep so late. I used to be carried in the arms of cheerleaders.
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<!--quoteo(post=60369:date=Aug 27 2009, 12:44 PM:name=Dirk)-->QUOTE (Dirk @ Aug 27 2009, 12:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->The bottom line for me is not whether Cubs fans are racist it's that this is playing out just like Jones and Hawkins and now we have to patiently count the days until Bradly is some other team's problem...which sucks.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
if bradley, jones, and hawkins kept their mouths shut, quit making excuses, and played well, this would never have been an isssue.
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Personally, I'd like Bradley to stick around. I don't want to trade him for half-price because he's disgruntled with the bleacher retards.
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<!--quoteo(post=60371:date=Aug 27 2009, 12:46 PM:name=BT)-->QUOTE (BT @ Aug 27 2009, 12:46 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=60368:date=Aug 27 2009, 12:44 PM:name=Scarey)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Scarey @ Aug 27 2009, 12:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->I still don't understand why you guys think that this has never happened where the fan was escorted out by security.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
what are you talking about? Are you saying a fan was escorted out for shouting racial slurs?
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I'm saying one, five, fifty, or whatever amount could have been. How would anyone know? I guess if it was a huge problem where a fan was getting kicked out every game we'd know about it, but I don't believe the Cubs is going to the newspapers reporting everytime they kick a fan out especially if it's for a lude or racially insensitive reason.
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<!--quoteo(post=60376:date=Aug 27 2009, 12:51 PM:name=Scarey)-->QUOTE (Scarey @ Aug 27 2009, 12:51 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=60371:date=Aug 27 2009, 12:46 PM:name=BT)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BT @ Aug 27 2009, 12:46 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=60368:date=Aug 27 2009, 12:44 PM:name=Scarey)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Scarey @ Aug 27 2009, 12:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->I still don't understand why you guys think that this has never happened where the fan was escorted out by security.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
what are you talking about? Are you saying a fan was escorted out for shouting racial slurs?
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I'm saying one, five, fifty, or whatever amount could have been. How would anyone know? I guess if it was a huge problem where a fan was getting kicked out every game we'd know about it, but I don't believe the Cubs is going to the newspapers reporting everytime they kick a fan out especially if it's for a lude or racially insensitive reason.
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It absolutely would be a story. If they're willing to run a story about vague insinuations about racially-charged incidents with the fans, then why wouldn't they run a story about an *actual* documented incident? At the very least, it seems like Sullivan (or whoever) would reference actual incidents if there were any.
My guess (emphasis on guess) is that Bradley has heard plenty of ignorant, insensitive stuff. The same sort of stuff that, say...Kevin Gregg might hear. Bradley is a sensitive dude. Bradley has heard about Hawkins and Jones getting shit on. Bradley puts 2 and 2 together and comes up with 5. "The fans called me a douchebag, or a sack or shit, or (whatever). They're doing that because I'm black. They hate black people."
The guy doesn't like to play in a hostile environment like Wrigley. He wants out. Is there an easier way to accomplish this?
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