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+--- Thread: Cubs spring training to Florida? (/thread-6289.html)
Cubs spring training to Florida? - Lance - 06-04-2010
<!--quoteo(post=99957:date=Jun 4 2010, 07:34 PM:name=Kid)-->QUOTE (Kid @ Jun 4 2010, 07:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99956:date=Jun 4 2010, 07:21 PM:name=Destined)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Destined @ Jun 4 2010, 07:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->All this push from local politicians for the California teams to leave Arizona over that law, is fucking ridiculous. If the Cubs left for that reason, I would disappointed in the franchise for letting such a petty political reason affect a ballclub.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
[1960]Yeah, why should anybody boycott the South because of Jim Crow laws? The South has a problem and it's trying to deal with it. Any boycott is just a petty political action.[/1960]
Fortunately, the law will be struck down in short order (not only for violating Equal Protection, but for violating the Supremacy Clause).
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm a little disappointed in your analogy. I agree with you on the Supreme Court invalidating this state law. However, I think there is a stretch in equating a state attempting to enforce federal law (against illegal immigration) and having laws which were clearly unconstitutional. In Arizona's defense, it is asking for help (albeit misguidedly and, perhaps in a racist manner) as opposed to a southern state deliberately flouting federal and constitutional protections.
Cubs spring training to Florida? - Kid - 06-04-2010
<!--quoteo(post=99968:date=Jun 4 2010, 08:34 PM:name=Lance)-->QUOTE (Lance @ Jun 4 2010, 08:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99957:date=Jun 4 2010, 07:34 PM:name=Kid)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kid @ Jun 4 2010, 07:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99956:date=Jun 4 2010, 07:21 PM:name=Destined)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Destined @ Jun 4 2010, 07:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->All this push from local politicians for the California teams to leave Arizona over that law, is fucking ridiculous. If the Cubs left for that reason, I would disappointed in the franchise for letting such a petty political reason affect a ballclub.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
[1960]Yeah, why should anybody boycott the South because of Jim Crow laws? The South has a problem and it's trying to deal with it. Any boycott is just a petty political action.[/1960]
Fortunately, the law will be struck down in short order (not only for violating Equal Protection, but for violating the Supremacy Clause).
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm a little disappointed in your analogy. I agree with you on the Supreme Court invalidating this state law. However, I think there is a stretch in equating a state attempting to enforce federal law (against illegal immigration) and having laws which were clearly unconstitutional. In Arizona's defense, it is asking for help (albeit misguidedly and, perhaps in a racist manner) as opposed to a southern state deliberately flouting federal and constitutional protections.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I wasn't equating the AZ law with Jim Crow. I was making a point about Destined's anti-boycott post.
Cubs spring training to Florida? - Lance - 06-04-2010
<!--quoteo(post=99969:date=Jun 4 2010, 08:35 PM:name=Kid)-->QUOTE (Kid @ Jun 4 2010, 08:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99968:date=Jun 4 2010, 08:34 PM:name=Lance)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Lance @ Jun 4 2010, 08:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99957:date=Jun 4 2010, 07:34 PM:name=Kid)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kid @ Jun 4 2010, 07:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99956:date=Jun 4 2010, 07:21 PM:name=Destined)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Destined @ Jun 4 2010, 07:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->All this push from local politicians for the California teams to leave Arizona over that law, is fucking ridiculous. If the Cubs left for that reason, I would disappointed in the franchise for letting such a petty political reason affect a ballclub.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
[1960]Yeah, why should anybody boycott the South because of Jim Crow laws? The South has a problem and it's trying to deal with it. Any boycott is just a petty political action.[/1960]
Fortunately, the law will be struck down in short order (not only for violating Equal Protection, but for violating the Supremacy Clause).
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm a little disappointed in your analogy. I agree with you on the Supreme Court invalidating this state law. However, I think there is a stretch in equating a state attempting to enforce federal law (against illegal immigration) and having laws which were clearly unconstitutional. In Arizona's defense, it is asking for help (albeit misguidedly and, perhaps in a racist manner) as opposed to a southern state deliberately flouting federal and constitutional protections.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I wasn't equating the AZ law with Jim Crow. I was making a point about Destined's anti-boycott post.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Gotcha. I misunderstood.
Cubs spring training to Florida? - Kid - 06-04-2010
<!--quoteo(post=99970:date=Jun 4 2010, 08:36 PM:name=Lance)-->QUOTE (Lance @ Jun 4 2010, 08:36 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99969:date=Jun 4 2010, 08:35 PM:name=Kid)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kid @ Jun 4 2010, 08:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99968:date=Jun 4 2010, 08:34 PM:name=Lance)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Lance @ Jun 4 2010, 08:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99957:date=Jun 4 2010, 07:34 PM:name=Kid)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kid @ Jun 4 2010, 07:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99956:date=Jun 4 2010, 07:21 PM:name=Destined)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Destined @ Jun 4 2010, 07:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->All this push from local politicians for the California teams to leave Arizona over that law, is fucking ridiculous. If the Cubs left for that reason, I would disappointed in the franchise for letting such a petty political reason affect a ballclub.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
[1960]Yeah, why should anybody boycott the South because of Jim Crow laws? The South has a problem and it's trying to deal with it. Any boycott is just a petty political action.[/1960]
Fortunately, the law will be struck down in short order (not only for violating Equal Protection, but for violating the Supremacy Clause).
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm a little disappointed in your analogy. I agree with you on the Supreme Court invalidating this state law. However, I think there is a stretch in equating a state attempting to enforce federal law (against illegal immigration) and having laws which were clearly unconstitutional. In Arizona's defense, it is asking for help (albeit misguidedly and, perhaps in a racist manner) as opposed to a southern state deliberately flouting federal and constitutional protections.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I wasn't equating the AZ law with Jim Crow. I was making a point about Destined's anti-boycott post.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Gotcha. I misunderstood.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Let me clarify a little further. I do believe Arizona's law to be racist. Obviously, Jim Crow was exponentially far more severe than the Arizona law, but I think in the end they are different symptoms of the same disease.
The racist elements of the law I believe justify the boycotts. I don't think boycotts would be appropriate in response to everyday political situations. California shouldn't boycott Arizona because Arizona is inadequately funding education, and Arizona shouldn't boycott California because California's taxes are too high. But a racist law is something else altogether.
Again, a much more extreme example, but most western countries, including the U.S., imposed sanctions on and boycotted South Africa during apartheid. I don't think there's many people arguing against that.
Cubs spring training to Florida? - Lance - 06-04-2010
<!--quoteo(post=99971:date=Jun 4 2010, 08:44 PM:name=Kid)-->QUOTE (Kid @ Jun 4 2010, 08:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99970:date=Jun 4 2010, 08:36 PM:name=Lance)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Lance @ Jun 4 2010, 08:36 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99969:date=Jun 4 2010, 08:35 PM:name=Kid)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kid @ Jun 4 2010, 08:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99968:date=Jun 4 2010, 08:34 PM:name=Lance)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Lance @ Jun 4 2010, 08:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99957:date=Jun 4 2010, 07:34 PM:name=Kid)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kid @ Jun 4 2010, 07:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99956:date=Jun 4 2010, 07:21 PM:name=Destined)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Destined @ Jun 4 2010, 07:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->All this push from local politicians for the California teams to leave Arizona over that law, is fucking ridiculous. If the Cubs left for that reason, I would disappointed in the franchise for letting such a petty political reason affect a ballclub.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
[1960]Yeah, why should anybody boycott the South because of Jim Crow laws? The South has a problem and it's trying to deal with it. Any boycott is just a petty political action.[/1960]
Fortunately, the law will be struck down in short order (not only for violating Equal Protection, but for violating the Supremacy Clause).
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm a little disappointed in your analogy. I agree with you on the Supreme Court invalidating this state law. However, I think there is a stretch in equating a state attempting to enforce federal law (against illegal immigration) and having laws which were clearly unconstitutional. In Arizona's defense, it is asking for help (albeit misguidedly and, perhaps in a racist manner) as opposed to a southern state deliberately flouting federal and constitutional protections.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I wasn't equating the AZ law with Jim Crow. I was making a point about Destined's anti-boycott post.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Gotcha. I misunderstood.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Let me clarify a little further. I do believe Arizona's law to be racist. Obviously, Jim Crow was exponentially far more severe than the Arizona law, but I think in the end they are different symptoms of the same disease.
The racist elements of the law I believe justify the boycotts. I don't think boycotts would be appropriate in response to everyday political situations. California shouldn't boycott Arizona because Arizona is inadequately funding education, and Arizona shouldn't boycott California because California's taxes are too high. But a racist law is something else altogether.
Again, a much more extreme example, but most western countries, including the U.S., imposed sanctions on and boycotted South Africa during apartheid. I don't think there's many people arguing against that.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Anyone can boycott anything because they do not agree with their policies. I don't think they need to be justified. However, I was amused by that Arizona power commission guy who invited L.A. to boycott their power supply.
On a side note, none of this solves Arizona's problem--a flood of illegal immigrants entering the state. It's a federal issue that the feds either can't or won't solve and Arizona is at the point of the spear.
Cubs spring training to Florida? - Kid - 06-04-2010
<!--quoteo(post=99972:date=Jun 4 2010, 08:49 PM:name=Lance)-->QUOTE (Lance @ Jun 4 2010, 08:49 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99971:date=Jun 4 2010, 08:44 PM:name=Kid)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kid @ Jun 4 2010, 08:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99970:date=Jun 4 2010, 08:36 PM:name=Lance)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Lance @ Jun 4 2010, 08:36 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99969:date=Jun 4 2010, 08:35 PM:name=Kid)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kid @ Jun 4 2010, 08:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99968:date=Jun 4 2010, 08:34 PM:name=Lance)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Lance @ Jun 4 2010, 08:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99957:date=Jun 4 2010, 07:34 PM:name=Kid)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kid @ Jun 4 2010, 07:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=99956:date=Jun 4 2010, 07:21 PM:name=Destined)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Destined @ Jun 4 2010, 07:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->All this push from local politicians for the California teams to leave Arizona over that law, is fucking ridiculous. If the Cubs left for that reason, I would disappointed in the franchise for letting such a petty political reason affect a ballclub.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
[1960]Yeah, why should anybody boycott the South because of Jim Crow laws? The South has a problem and it's trying to deal with it. Any boycott is just a petty political action.[/1960]
Fortunately, the law will be struck down in short order (not only for violating Equal Protection, but for violating the Supremacy Clause).
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm a little disappointed in your analogy. I agree with you on the Supreme Court invalidating this state law. However, I think there is a stretch in equating a state attempting to enforce federal law (against illegal immigration) and having laws which were clearly unconstitutional. In Arizona's defense, it is asking for help (albeit misguidedly and, perhaps in a racist manner) as opposed to a southern state deliberately flouting federal and constitutional protections.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I wasn't equating the AZ law with Jim Crow. I was making a point about Destined's anti-boycott post.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Gotcha. I misunderstood.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Let me clarify a little further. I do believe Arizona's law to be racist. Obviously, Jim Crow was exponentially far more severe than the Arizona law, but I think in the end they are different symptoms of the same disease.
The racist elements of the law I believe justify the boycotts. I don't think boycotts would be appropriate in response to everyday political situations. California shouldn't boycott Arizona because Arizona is inadequately funding education, and Arizona shouldn't boycott California because California's taxes are too high. But a racist law is something else altogether.
Again, a much more extreme example, but most western countries, including the U.S., imposed sanctions on and boycotted South Africa during apartheid. I don't think there's many people arguing against that.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Anyone can boycott anything because they do not agree with their policies. I don't think they need to be justified. However, I was amused by that Arizona power commission guy who invited L.A. to boycott their power supply.
On a side note, none of this solves Arizona's problem--a flood of illegal immigrants entering the state. It's a federal issue that the feds either can't or won't solve and Arizona is at the point of the spear.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Oh I agree that anyone can boycott, though I think there's a difference between private citizens boycotting and one state boycotting another. I think it should take something particularly exception to justify that.
Ironically, Bush, as a former border state governor, I thought had a very pragmatic and logical approach to immigration. It's too bad Congress couldn't get it done.
Cubs spring training to Florida? - Lance - 06-04-2010
Must be the end of the world: me supporting Obama (in another thread) and Kid supporting Bush.
Cubs spring training to Florida? - Rappster - 06-05-2010
<!--quoteo(post=99974:date=Jun 4 2010, 07:53 PM:name=Lance)-->QUOTE (Lance @ Jun 4 2010, 07:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Must be the end of the world: me supporting Obama (in another thread) and Kid supporting Bush.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's actually the way it's supposed to work...remember when we didn't have to wait for party approval before agreeing with someone from the other side?
Still...I like it.
Cubs spring training to Florida? - rok - 07-14-2010
This was announced yesterday, but I guess Florida is officially out of the running now.
http://www.azcentral.com/community/mesa/ar...g-training.html
<!--quoteo-->QUOTE <!--quotec-->Florida business interests are withdrawing their offer to host spring training for the Chicago Cubs in Naples, a victory for Mesa officials who have been working to save the city's top tourist attraction and the Cactus League's top draw.
The Cubs declined to give the Naples group exclusive negotiating rights and informed them that they are continuing to work with Mesa to close a deal for construction of a new stadium and spring training complex, said Craig Bouchard, a principle investor in Naples group.
"For the time being, we have withdrawn our offer," he said. "The Cubs said, 'we still need to keep talking to Mesa."'<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Cubs spring training to Florida? - Scarey - 07-14-2010
I blame LeBron.
Cubs spring training to Florida? - 1060Ivy - 07-14-2010
I blame ...
I blame ...
society!
Hell, if that doesn't work you can always say it was Obama's fault!