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+--- Thread: Why not have Bradley lead off? (/thread-8077.html)
Why not have Bradley lead off? - sleepyhead - 01-06-2009
<!--quoteo(post=9381:date=Jan 6 2009, 12:15 PM:name=KBwsb)-->QUOTE (KBwsb @ Jan 6 2009, 12:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=9379:date=Jan 6 2009, 12:10 PM:name=sleepyhead)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (sleepyhead @ Jan 6 2009, 12:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=9356:date=Jan 6 2009, 11:13 AM:name=bz)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (bz @ Jan 6 2009, 11:13 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=9351:date=Jan 6 2009, 11:06 AM:name=KBwsb)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (KBwsb @ Jan 6 2009, 11:06 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Saying Fuk is better than Dunn is....it's just absurd. Or Fuk/Johnson.
But have at it.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
He didn't say that. He said the team is better with those players. There was no direct comparison position to position.
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Exactly. Sori in LF, Dunn in RF and Bradley in CF could be the worst defensive outfield ever.
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It'd be a bad one. And it'd be one of the best <i>offensive</i> outfields ever.
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No it wouldn't. It would produce a lot of HRs, that's about it.
Dunn is not a superstar caliber player. He's not as good as Soriano who barely makes up for his defensive liabilities. Dunn is an embarrassment in LF, I don't remember the last Cubs/Reds series where he didn't fall down or do something tremendously stupid.
Why not have Bradley lead off? - kbwsb - 01-06-2009
OK, I'm going to change my signature.
Why not have Bradley lead off? - sleepyhead - 01-06-2009
<!--quoteo(post=9386:date=Jan 6 2009, 12:24 PM:name=KBwsb)-->QUOTE (KBwsb @ Jan 6 2009, 12:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->OK, I'm going to change my signature.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm sorry are you saying Dunn isn't a defensive liability? Are you saying Ozzie Smith was?
this isn't entirely anecdotal. I may not watch every Reds games, but I've seen enough and heard analysis from enough experts to know that I'm not wrong.
Why not have Bradley lead off? - kbwsb - 01-06-2009
<!--quoteo(post=9387:date=Jan 6 2009, 12:29 PM:name=sleepyhead)-->QUOTE (sleepyhead @ Jan 6 2009, 12:29 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=9386:date=Jan 6 2009, 12:24 PM:name=KBwsb)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (KBwsb @ Jan 6 2009, 12:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->OK, I'm going to change my signature.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm sorry are you saying Dunn isn't a defensive liability? Are you saying Ozzie Smith was?
this isn't entirely anecdotal. I may not watch every Reds games, but I've seen enough and heard analysis from enough experts to know that I'm not wrong.
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Sleepy, I never said Dunn wasn't a defensive liability.
He is. You can quote me on it.
I'm saying that baseball analysts have discovered that fielders are just like hitters...they have up and down years, they whither with age, they can get streaky, they can improve, etc.
We fans tend to basically judge fielders by 3 judgements: he sucks, he's OK, he's good.
Only it's a LOT more complicated than that.
When someone says "Dunn is the worst LFer on earth," does that sound like a sound statistical analysis, backed by copious research? Or does it sound like a fan who saw Dunn stumble around Wrigley on a number of occasions? I'm going with the latter, cuz I've seen the same thing you have.
Why not have Bradley lead off? - veryzer - 01-06-2009
<!--quoteo(post=9394:date=Jan 6 2009, 12:38 PM:name=KBwsb)-->QUOTE (KBwsb @ Jan 6 2009, 12:38 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=9387:date=Jan 6 2009, 12:29 PM:name=sleepyhead)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (sleepyhead @ Jan 6 2009, 12:29 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=9386:date=Jan 6 2009, 12:24 PM:name=KBwsb)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (KBwsb @ Jan 6 2009, 12:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->OK, I'm going to change my signature.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm sorry are you saying Dunn isn't a defensive liability? Are you saying Ozzie Smith was?
this isn't entirely anecdotal. I may not watch every Reds games, but I've seen enough and heard analysis from enough experts to know that I'm not wrong.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Sleepy, I never said Dunn wasn't a defensive liability.
He is. You can quote me on it.
I'm saying that baseball analysts have discovered that fielders are just like hitters...they have up and down years, they whither with age, they can get streaky, they can improve, etc.
We fans tend to basically judge fielders by 3 judgements: he sucks, he's OK, he's good.
Only it's a LOT more complicated than that.
When someone says "Dunn is the worst LFer on earth," does that sound like a sound statistical analysis, backed by copious research? Or does it sound like a fan who saw Dunn stumble around Wrigley on a number of occasions? I'm going with the latter, cuz I've seen the same thing you have.
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does dunn <i>know</i> you're his father? maybe you could get us some good seats or something.
Why not have Bradley lead off? - kbwsb - 01-06-2009
<!--quoteo(post=9400:date=Jan 6 2009, 12:46 PM:name=veryzer)-->QUOTE (veryzer @ Jan 6 2009, 12:46 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=9394:date=Jan 6 2009, 12:38 PM:name=KBwsb)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (KBwsb @ Jan 6 2009, 12:38 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=9387:date=Jan 6 2009, 12:29 PM:name=sleepyhead)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (sleepyhead @ Jan 6 2009, 12:29 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=9386:date=Jan 6 2009, 12:24 PM:name=KBwsb)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (KBwsb @ Jan 6 2009, 12:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->OK, I'm going to change my signature.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm sorry are you saying Dunn isn't a defensive liability? Are you saying Ozzie Smith was?
this isn't entirely anecdotal. I may not watch every Reds games, but I've seen enough and heard analysis from enough experts to know that I'm not wrong.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Sleepy, <b>I never said Dunn wasn't a defensive liability.
He is. You can quote me on it.</b>
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
does dunn <i>know</i> you're his father? maybe you could get us some good seats or something.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Does that sound like the sort of thing a kindly daddy would say about his offspring?
(He's a good boy.)
Why not have Bradley lead off? - veryzer - 01-06-2009
<!--quoteo(post=9409:date=Jan 6 2009, 12:57 PM:name=KBwsb)-->QUOTE (KBwsb @ Jan 6 2009, 12:57 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=9400:date=Jan 6 2009, 12:46 PM:name=veryzer)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (veryzer @ Jan 6 2009, 12:46 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=9394:date=Jan 6 2009, 12:38 PM:name=KBwsb)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (KBwsb @ Jan 6 2009, 12:38 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=9387:date=Jan 6 2009, 12:29 PM:name=sleepyhead)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (sleepyhead @ Jan 6 2009, 12:29 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=9386:date=Jan 6 2009, 12:24 PM:name=KBwsb)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (KBwsb @ Jan 6 2009, 12:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->OK, I'm going to change my signature.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm sorry are you saying Dunn isn't a defensive liability? Are you saying Ozzie Smith was?
this isn't entirely anecdotal. I may not watch every Reds games, but I've seen enough and heard analysis from enough experts to know that I'm not wrong.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Sleepy, <b>I never said Dunn wasn't a defensive liability.
He is. You can quote me on it.</b>
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
does dunn <i>know</i> you're his father? maybe you could get us some good seats or something.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Does that sound like the sort of thing a kindly daddy would say about his offspring?
(He's a good boy.)
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
it depends on whether he knows or not.
Why not have Bradley lead off? - kbwsb - 01-06-2009
His mom was a dog.
Why not have Bradley lead off? - Jody - 01-06-2009
<!--quoteo(post=9421:date=Jan 6 2009, 01:15 PM:name=KBwsb)-->QUOTE (KBwsb @ Jan 6 2009, 01:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->His mom was a dog.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
A St. Bernard judging by the looks of him.
Why not have Bradley lead off? - kbwsb - 01-06-2009
Yeah, she drooled a lot, and was a bitch. Good licker, though.
Why not have Bradley lead off? - Mikey - 01-06-2009
1. Theriot
2. Lee
3. Ramirez
4. Bradley
5. Soriano
6. Soto
7. Fontenot/Miles
8. Fuk/Reed
Why not have Bradley lead off? - Clapp - 01-06-2009
I really can't see the team going on and on about getting more left-handed, then only having 1 lefty bat in their first 6. I'd guess as I posted the other day:
Soriano
Fontenot/Miles
Lee
Bradley
Ramirez
Soto
Fuk
Theriot
And I'm fine with it.
Why not have Bradley lead off? - twitterwoods - 01-07-2009
I'd be fine with this (even though I'd prefer Alf not to lead off). I fully expect Lee to still bat 3rd, but one can dream...
Soriano - R
Miles - S
Ramirez - R
Bradley - S
Lee - R
Soto - R
Fukudome - L
Theriot - R
Why not have Bradley lead off? - HTC - 01-07-2009
I don't want Lee hitting second and I don't want him hitting third. If Soriano's healthy enough to steal bases like he started doing toward the end of 08, I could probably handle Lee hitting second, but if not, you're just asking for double plays in front of the heart of the order. Lee needs to be hitting about fifth or sixth at this point.
Why not have Bradley lead off? - Clapp - 01-07-2009
<!--quoteo(post=9666:date=Jan 6 2009, 10:11 PM:name=HTC)-->QUOTE (HTC @ Jan 6 2009, 10:11 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->I don't want Lee hitting second and I don't want him hitting third. If Soriano's healthy enough to steal bases like he started doing toward the end of 08, I could probably handle Lee hitting second, but if not, you're just asking for double plays in front of the heart of the order. Lee needs to be hitting about fifth or sixth at this point.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
If he's not batting behind Theriot, he's not going to hit into nearly as many DP's. He had more DP chances than anybody in baseball by a lot because Theriot only hits singles or walks in front of him. In fact, it happened <b>230 times </b>last year(1b, bb, hbp). His history would also suggest his lack of power was more of a fluke than his big increase in groundballs. We'll see. I'm sure he's every bit as frustrated about it as we are and is working to get the loft back in his swing. It's possible he's never a 30 homer hitter anymore, but it's very possible he never has that high of a groundball rate again as well. The bottom line is he's still a very good hitter, and where he bats won't make a difference on our outcome this year.